These are the old FoMoCo Obsolete Forums and are being hosted by JCOConsulting.com.
While you're here, check out my articles or have a look around at some of the
Ford Stuff we have for sale. You might find something you can't live without.
|
|
|
|
Skip Navigation Links.
 |  dipping cars? -- joe ligon, 08/13/2000
i own a 66 fairlane gta conv and i was interested in having the body dipped in order to remove the paint and minor rust.(AZ car)has anyone tried this and if so what results did you have? also does anyone no of a company doing this in the Richmond Va. area. or in the surrounding states?
thanks,
joe |
|  | RE: dipping cars? -- jgb, 08/13/2000
try hemmings motor news there are quite a few
there is even one large chain of shops but i cant remember the name. bear in mind that dipping requires removal of every thing. bushings, seam seal,lines, glass, harnesses and chaulking you will basically be building the car from scratch when it done.
hope this helps |
| | | RE: dipping cars? -- 57 Custom300, 08/14/2000
Redi-Strip is the name. I believe there is one in Pennsylvania, one in NY, Memphis, and maybe IL. Can't find my Hemmings right now, but I'll look later and try to get a number for you. |
| | | | RE: dipping cars? -- Lou, 08/14/2000
Dipping will take paint off of places that you can not repaint unless you paint dip the car like the factory does. Like inside of the hood, the trunk, inside the torque boxes and inside the frame rails. I do not think that a good solid car unibody car should be dipped unless you are dipping to remove rust.
I would have the outside of the car bead blasted, I've done this and you can not belive how nice the surface is to repaint.
This is my opinion and would like to hear what others think.
|
| | | |  | RE: dipping cars? -- 57 Custom300, 08/14/2000
I agree with Lou, as the dipping process also removes ALL body sealers, which will have to be replaced. This includes places you can not see without cutting multiple layers apart. I have had experience with the media blasting, and it is a much more end-user-friendly process. Just be sure to get all the media out of nooks and crannies. Ours was done with ground up lexan(plastic blasting), and was a real pain in the butt to get all the stuff out of the cowl(`65 Mustang 2+2). Leaves a nice surface that holds primer and paint well. Also much more cost efficent(about $600-700) vs. approx $1500-2000. Just something to think about. |
| | | | | | RE: dipping cars? -- Phill Oppelt, 08/15/2000
Hello:
I don't know about back east but here in
wasington state there are several places that
use soda to strip with and I am going to have
this done to my convert. I have been told that
when they are finnished you can leave the car
out in the rain in bare metal and it wont rust.
I wouldn't do it but sounds good. also it's
suposed to take paint very nicely when finnished.
Phill O. |
| | | | | |  | RE: dipping cars? -- jgb, 08/15/2000
soda is the newest thing out there, i hear that you can even leave thoe chrome and glass in place
if the person knows what there doing, now thats got to save you a ton of time and money |
| | | | | RE: dipping cars? -- Lou, 08/15/2000
What does soda leave on the car that stops it from rusting? I would try it on a small part like a aircleaner first to see what problems there are. What are you going to do if 2 years from now your paint comes off in sheets? |
| | | | | | RE: dipping cars? -- joe ligon, 08/16/2000
my guess would be drive it through the walls of the shop that did until you're satisfied. my serious guess would be to ask them up front and get their response in writing.
joe |
| | | | | | | RE: dipping cars? -- 57 Custom300, 08/17/2000
If you're still interested in the dipping process, check out the new issue of CarCraft.. They show the pros and cons of the process. Check it out. |
| | | | | | | | RE: dipping cars? -- joe ligon, 08/17/2000
THANKS,
joe |
| 427 or Not? -- "Alvin Jay" Halloway, 08/12/2000
A guy here is selling a '65 Galaxie with what he says is a 427 in it. Heads are C4AE and intake is low-rise C5AE. Can't seem to find the block casting number. I know 427's have cross-bolt mains, but (here comes the ignorance) do the extra main cap bolts go in from the side of the block? Is there any other sure-fire way to identify the engine as being a 427? The only other way I've heard of is by determining the stroke length. |
| | RE: 427 or Not? -- Lou, 08/12/2000
Yes the main bearing bolt go in from the outside of the block, and the head are visable. |
| | | RE: 427 or Not? -- "Alvin Jay" Halloway, 08/12/2000
Absolutely phenomenal response time. Thanks, I'll pass on to the seller that it's not what he was told. |
| | don't go by stroke -- Bob, 08/14/2000
Don't try to I.D. by stroke, 390 and 406 have the same stroke also. Check bore, if its 4.23" its a 427. [4.13" is 406 and 4.05" is 390] |
| 5.0 and super fords yuck yuck yuck (long) -- don jr, 08/12/2000
ive been reading super ford since i found my first issue in june of 1990. its my all time favorite car rag. i was really hurt when Dobbs sold out to peterson but i survived when the mag didnt change too much. But to join it with 5.0 and have no early models really sucks. i like late model mustangs. my wish car is a whipple charged 351 in a 79 with a tremec and a 4.10 geared 8.8. but i love my 65 f100 with its tired 352 and ive only driven it 20 miles since i bought it. im guess im stuck with mustang and fords. thanks peterson for killing my favorite read. you just lost my $4 a month |
| | RE: 5.0 and super fords yuck yuck yuck (long) -- RC Moser, 08/13/2000
Don, the mag. is going to sell to the most viewed public. This happens to be the new pony's. I too am a old FE and 385 fan, but todays engines are lighter, faster, get better gas mileage, and really can blow the old high compression engine away due to the advances in fuel injection and cam designs. Guess techology and lighter weight has a big advanage. I can remember My dad and uncle talking about the Y block VS the flathead. Guess you seem to stick with the one you most enjoyed when you were young. One thing I can say is the older cars were more afordable than the new super cars. OF course this is just my opinion and take it for what it's worth "absolutely Nothing" RC |
| | | RE: 5.0 and super fords yuck yuck yuck (long) -- don jr, 08/13/2000
im 28. i grew up around the vintage iron my uncle had but i also helped the boys in school tune their 5.0's. Im just a die hard Ford fan. I really do like the late mustangs but theres MUCH more to being a ford fan than just a 5.0 or a 4.6.
I remember when ford parts were twice what chevy parts cost. when it was hard to be a ford lover. when Bob Glidden was all we had to cheer for. I like it now we have cheaper parts. but i still love the vintage iron and i know lots of people who do to. and id rather read about some new tech for the big blocks than the dime a dozen 5.0 roller rocker and underdrive pulley stories. I love race cars too but the 5.0 mags are all race cars. i want to see some street machines and daily drivers. oh well i guess ill get off my soapbox. and if u cant beat them join them. guess i need to start on that whipplecharged 351 stroker. |
| | | | RE: 5.0 and super fords yuck yuck yuck (long) -- 57 Custom300, 08/13/2000
Don, if you wanna build a 351 stroker, get in touch with me...I have some new stuff I would like to trade for some FE stuff, or sell outright..Give me an old car with an FE any day over anything new with that pitiful 4.6, that thing weighs as much as an FE, and would likely be eaten alive and spat out by the same. Ahhh, the old days....Ditto to Petersen/emap, no more of my $$... |
| Head recommendation for 390 -- Grant, 08/12/2000
Thanks to all that replied to my head/intake code questions. Based on them being quite common and having no real perf. features/potential, what bolt-on, readily/easily available Ford code heads or even aftermarket heads would you recommend for a 390GT? NOT a strip car...just want a little more fun <grin> but not thrilled with $1,200 for Edelbrock Performer RPM aluminum ones...or are they really worth the $$$?
Is this REALLY a bolt on project? Any other mods or pair of hands required when adding a diff. set of heads? Probably smart to do cam at same time? Honest enough to admit this is something I've never done all by myself...and my memory from doing this 20 yrs ago is foggy...
Thanks!
Grant
|
|  | RE: Head recommendation for 390 -- Ed Foral, 08/12/2000
Grant
You could just take your heads, drop in CJ valves, clean up the ports a little yourself, and with a new cam and intake, you can get the little boost you want.
Ed |
| | Edelbrock head problems -- Matt, 08/14/2000
If you go with Edel Heads, these are the problems I ran into:
1)If you reuse the factory rockershaft bolts, 2 of them will have to be trimmed 1/4" because two of the holes are not tapped far enough. I did this and when I tried to torque them to the proper ft/lbs, they kept turning and wouldn't tighten...I think they started to pull the coil threads out...I'm really upset about this.
2) Factory GT 390 exhaust manifold do NOT match the bolt pattern on the heads...I'm really really mad about this.
3)The heads of the factory head bolts are too large to fit into the recesses on the heads. The only way to correctrly do the job is to get a new set of head bolts that have a smaller head. Edelbrock gets a big thumbs down for all three of these issues. |
| | | RE: Edelbrock head problems -- Hot Rod Lorenzen, 08/18/2000
Thanks for the "Heads Up" Matt! Which head did you use? It was a while back when I saw the ad, but I think I remember two head styles offered. I think the other one had different manifold bolt pattern like the 428cj. |
| | | | RE: Edelbrock head problems -- Matt, 08/18/2000
I believe the part # is 6006. This is the complete 390/428 head. The other part # is the same exact head but bare.
There was a definite power increase with these heads but not nearly what I thought. Part of the problem is my cam and exhaust, and after I improve them , I'm hoping for some big time horsepower!
Matt |
| | | | | RE: Edelbrock head problems -- Robert, 08/18/2000
Ed heads are available in two types 390/428 and 427 both are avail in assembled and bare. the quality is darn good for the money. I have a 427 stroker and went to Vic Ed himself to confirm that the 390/428s are the way to go due to far superior chambers as compared to the 427 wedge dinosaurs.I had to really do a lot of work to hide that gross volume and get the CR down.
As to power the Ed Heads are light years ahead of the vintage Ford and for that matter Shelbys and a lot of the Dove$ Heads. |
| | | | | | RE: Edelbrock head problems -- Grant, 08/20/2000
Matt, I'll have to forward you (didn't I already?) Edel. response on your problems. They basically own up to one thing but blame all others on you not using their washer kit? |
| FMX/CruiseO/or C6? How to tell? -- Grant, 08/12/2000
Had a buddy let me get my '66 Galaxie, 390GT, FMX/CruiseO? on a lift and this is what I discovered:
Trans pan has 14 bolts with an unusual pan design...not perfectly square or rectangular...has one corner that kinda cut in. Also, linkage and vacuum module are on driver's side. Put a magnet up to it...only sticks to pan, did not stick to case.
Now I'm really confused...magnet test would say C6...pan design suggests FMX...any thoughts?
Really leaked this weekend...yet it shifts and drives smoothly. Might be cheaper to do a converter,shift kit, and seal repair for this trans than putting in a "new" C6...Ideally just want to launch a bit harder and "chirp" the tires when I get on it. Not a strip car...just want to go hard to speed limit...you know, stop light racing!
Thanks for your time and help!
Grant Dahlke |
| | RE: FMX/CruiseO/or C6? How to tell? -- don jr, 08/12/2000
is the bellhousing removable? c6 bellhousings are not removable. fmx and c4 have a removable bell. |
| axel -- Paul Davis, 08/12/2000
Does anyone make heavy duty 28 spline axels for ford 9" that will handle 425 hp FE. Have mustang 390 car stock with 28 spline. Thank you Paul Davis
|
| 428 Engine I.D. -- Ron, 08/12/2000
I am considering purchasing a 69 Torino with a 428 engine. The car is originally a 390 car and I'd like to better verify the current 428 engine. The engine is still in the car and the owner is not too familiar with Ford part numbers, and neither am I for that matter. All I have to go on right now is one image of the engine from the front of the car, and the following #'s, block C7ME-A and intake C9ZE-9425-B. I am not able to inspect the car personally, as it is in a different state. There is no carb with the engine and the owner is not able to identify if the exhaust is 428 CJ style or not. I am trying to at least verify if the exhaust pattern is staggered as opposed to vertical. Can anyone help with what little information I have provided? Are there any other external visible clues, perhaps the smog fittings on the exhaust, or??? By the way, this engine may not be a CJ, but perhaps a regular 428.
Thanks in advance for any help. |
| | RE: 428 Engine I.D. -- Dave Shoe, 08/12/2000
It sounds like it may be a regular 428, but it may also be a bored out 360 or 390 block, meaning it might have very thin cylinder walls if an unknowledgeable engine rebuilder thought that C7ME-A 360/390 blocks were the same as C7ME-A 428plain blocks (they are not the same casting - the 428plain uses different cylinder cores due to the larger bore).
It's a risky purchase, but probably worth looking into. Also note that the reinforced 428CJ/PI casting of 1969-70 is not the same as the 428plain casting. Some early 1968-1/2 428CJ motors were rumored to get the 428plain casting, but 20 pounds was added to the CJ/PI block when the reinforced main webs and thicker cylinders were incorporated in the later blocks. Both blocks are gerat for racing (hey, 20 lbs lighter is 20 lbs faster), as long as they sonic out properly.
JMO,
Shoe.
|
| | | RE: 428 Engine I.D. -- Ron, 08/12/2000
Thanks for the info. Shoe, from this I gather that the engine may really only be a 360 or 390 anyway, perhaps being passed off as a 428. Does the intake #C9ZE-9425-B lend a clue at all, (is this a Mustang part?) Is C7ME-A the correct number for a 390GT engine? I guess it may be possible that this is the original engine..., and not a 428 at all. By the way, will 428CJ exhaust manifolds bolt up to the 390 Torino/Mustang heads?
Ron |
| | | | RE: 428 Engine I.D. -- Dave Shoe, 08/12/2000
I seem to recall the CJ intake has "C8OE" cast into it (I'm not gonna check my garage to verify which yours is), so you've probably got a plain old emissions era "Equal Runner" (aka: "S") intake on your hands or else an emissions era "Low Riser" (aka: "T") intake. Look on the top of the #1 runner for the casting identifier. There really were no other choices from 1968-on. I'm not fond of either intake, though both can surpass 400HP with little effort.
The CJ exhaust manifold WILL bolt up to 390 Fairl/Must-type heads, as long as you are willing to drill one extra hole in the top-rear of one of the heads (I forget which side), as stock 390 Fairl/Must-type heads have offset these upper-end holes down 1/4" or so. Drilling WILL cause the two holes to merge, forming a figure-8, so it's a bunch suckier to tap than it might seem. You might, instead, just run a clearance bolt in the new hole, and back it with a nut.
Also, CJ exh manifolds will port-match the low-exit ports of the 390 head, but the tiny 390 Fairl/Must exh manifold will NOT port match the high-exit ports of the CJ head.
If the motor is in the car, you obviously cannot drill that top-rear hole.
Good luck,
Shoe. |
| | RE: 428 Engine I.D. -- Ed Foral, 08/12/2000
Ron
The block casting number is no help differing between a 428 or 390. The intake is definitely a 390 part. The head casting numbers are between the center 2 exhaust ports.
If the Torino is in good shape and the price is reasonable, then it is worth getting whether the engine is a 390 or a 428.
If the seller can not verify that it is a 428, then he/she has to price the car as if it were a 390.
It is easy to change the engine later if you want more cubes.
One thing that can be done is check behind the drivers' side head on the block for a stamping. If the stamping matches the car, then it is the original 390.
Ed |
| | RE: 428 Engine I.D. -- Mike D, 08/18/2000
My C7MEA block is a 428 with reinforced webbing and a big C in the rear wich everybody calls a CJ block but I took it from its original home in a 68 Merc wagon. |
| | | RE: 428 Engine I.D. -- Dave Shoe, 08/20/2000
That's an uncommon and lucky find.
Shoe. |
| | | | RE: 428 Engine I.D. -- RC Moser, 08/22/2000
I'd check the flex plate or flywheel, their is a noticable differents between a 390 and a 428 Flex plate or flywheel. The only problem would be if someone just stuck the thing togather with assortment of parts? |
| TOO Hot ...still? -- Big Daddy, 08/11/2000
Im running a fresh 390 in a 68 Torino. Its been bored 30 over,forged pistons, has Edelbrock Complete aluminum heads, Performer RPM manifold, Cam (7106), 750 cfm carb, MSD 6 with billet distributor,headers ... new flowmaster water pump,recored radiator,auxilary fan,trans cooler,and a relocated oil filter ... running a 160 degree thermostat....
Im still running hot ... the fan kicks on at 190, but when i hit a red light or even running along at 65 mph it will creep up to 210+ ...Ive put on the proper fan shroud...what else can I do???????? |
| | RE: TOO Hot ...still? -- skycop, 08/11/2000
I have read that the forged pistons need more clearence than cast due to a greater expansion rate. If this is the case you may not have enough clearence between the cyl walls and the pistons which could easily create enough friction to account for the high temps. If the overbore and pistons were matched correctly by the builder this should not be a problem and I have done all this typing for nothing.
Al
the skycop |
| | | I HOPE Not!!! -- Big Daddy, 08/11/2000
I hope not ...I've had this monster out twice and the tranny once and with those headers and shock towers Its not a fun task! |
| | RE: TOO Hot ...still? -- Phill Oppelt, 08/12/2000
Don't know for sure if this is your problem, and
this is gonna sound backward to you but try changing your thermostat to a 192 degree
this will allow the radiator to properly cool
before it gets a fresh load of hot coolant
I had this prob with a fresh 427 for two weeks
changed the thermostat to 192 and cured it
Phill O. |
| | RE: TOO Hot ...still? -- John Duran, 08/13/2000
The thermostat could be the problem ,but i have known friends who put in the pistons in backwards and did not know it . If one is in backwards it will overheat .
Other than that make sure they sold you the right head gasket for those aluminum heads too.
laters.
John |
| Is anyone interested in a 60" 352 HP. -- Phill Oppelt, 08/11/2000
I've not been to this forum before but thought
someone may be interested in the 360 horse 352
that I have had stored under the bench in my
shop for some 10 years now. also have a very
nice set of 63 gal. 427 cast long headers.
and a not so bad shape 67 gal.
Reply to E-mail for more info.
Thanks Phill O. |
| | RE: Is anyone interested in a 60" 352 HP. -- Lou, 08/11/2000
I would be interested in the 352 HiPo, I have a 60 Bird with the HiPo and overdrive. A spare engine is always nice to have. Let me know where you are and what you are asking for the engine. Lou at vehicle@snet.net |
| | | RE: Is anyone interested in a 60" 352 HP. -- Phill Oppelt, 08/16/2000
Lou:
Sorry for not responding to your post right away
, Ed E-mailed me before your post came up and
we are in the middle of decifering part #s to
see that it actualy is a 60 352 hp. He asked me
to find date codes but the thing just doesn't
have any. I am going to tear it all completely
apart today. hopefully we can get some answers.
Cast #s are. EDE-D intake, EDD 11 crank, EDC-C
Block, EDC-E heads EDC-C Exhaust. All bare the
same cast 77 o X. any help would be greatly
appreciated. again sorry I wasn't snubbing you.
Phill O. |
| | | | Re: 60" 352, 360 hp. -- Lou, 08/16/2000
A HiPo 352 uses a 1959 block, the intake is alum. (looks like a 427 low riser) but has no part number or date code, just a small Ford oval. It is a solid lifter engine with adjustable rockers. The carb is COAE--J
If the engine was in a car it would have the COAE headers, it in a T-bird it would use standard 352 exhaust manifolds.
Bay any chance you wouldn't have a set of 1960 HiPo 15 inch wheels? |
| | RE: Is anyone interested in a 60" 352 HP. -- Paul H. Kaminen, 08/17/2000
1. How much for the engine?
2. How much for the headers? |
| 428 swap with 289 -- Willard A. Davis, 08/10/2000
Is it possible to swap a 428cj into a stock '67+ mustang with a 289? Or do I have to find a mustang that was ordered with the 390? Thanks for any help. |
| | RE: 428 swap with 289 -- Dave Shoe, 08/10/2000
It's an easy swap.
The original motor mounts will need to either be redrilled at one hole or else replaced with Mustang FE motor mounts.
There are differences between AT and 4-speed swaps, but it's basically an easy job. Easy, assuming you enjoy the cramped confines that an FE consumes in in ANY '67-'70 Mustang.
The 250CID+ Mustang got 5-lug wheels, but non-HiPo 289s got 8" rears. 8" is plenty in a Mustang, even for a warmed over 428 motor. You will want to keep an eye out for a 9" housing and heavier axleshafts (both plentiful if you know how to look) should you go with sticky, wide tires, steep gears, or just plain enjoy sidestepping the clutch a lot (not required with a 428).
Have fun. The swap is NOT a nightmare. Elbow access under the hood is.
Shoe. |
| | RE: 428 swap with 289 -- Clif, 08/23/2000
C.J. Pony Parts (800-888-6473) lists a complete FE engine into '67 to '70 Mustang motor mount and frame bracket kit for approx. $275. Don't forget to replace the front coils and the radiator. |
| | | RE: 428 swap with 289 -- Dave Shoe, 08/23/2000
I bought yet another pair of FE motor mount brackets for a Mustang and paid $25.00 for the set-up.
Five years back I bought some factory-tagged NOS brackets from a local old-Ford only junkyard for $50.00 all together.
For $275, redrilling the 289 brackets (same bracket - three holes moved) starts to look really wise.
Shoe. |
| | | | RE: 428 swap with 289 -- Willard A. Davis, 08/23/2000
I just wanted to thank you both for responding. I do appreciate it. Thanks for the help.
Will |
| | | | RE: 428 swap with 289 -- Clif, 08/24/2000
I agree Shoe. Prices on some of the stuff I have seen makes me wonder how a person can keep a classic car project going without taking out a second mortgage. |
|
|
|
|