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| 75 psi too much oil pressure for 390? -- Steve M, 03/31/2004
I just hooked up an oil pressure gauge to my 390 and it shows 50-75 psi oil pressure. Is that too much? It is just a stock 390 from 1970 and I threw on an edelbrock performer manifold and headers. Everything else is stock. Also, what is everybody's opinion on oil? 10w30,10w40,20w50?
Thanks |
| Front crossmember -- Mike, 03/30/2004
Is the front crossmember, under the pan & attaches tot he bottom of the shock tower, the same for an FE as it is for a smallblock?
Thanks, Mike |
| | Beats me. What model & year are we talking about? [n/m] -- Mr F, 03/31/2004
n/m |
| | On a '69 Mustang, yes - same crossmember, for all. [n/m] -- Mr F, 04/04/2004
n/m |
| whats the differences between 390 and 428 scj? -- james, 03/29/2004
what exactly is the difference between the 390 engines and the 428 super cobra jets? i would really appreciate it if someone could tell me. |
| carb. spacer. -- metraman, 03/28/2004
have 67 gal.500 390 2v., 2100 series carb.i want to take off factory water heater spacer. now i have a 289 2v. spacer that is about 1/16 or 1/32 narrower in fuel/air holes. but the 289 spacer is the exact dia. of manifold holes,so it should not restrict flow of air/fuel , correct? also second question. i purchased 2 plastic 2v. spacers, each 1/2 high to keep carb. cooler in summer. one just has 2 reg. holes and the other has 2 holes, but come to a point together in the center,so not two separate holes. which one of these should i use? can they be stacked for additional heat insulation? |
| | RE: carb. spacer. -- giacamo, 03/28/2004
you probley can use any combo and still be ok.i,v sean them all the ways you describe and thay all seam to work. |
| | RE: carb. spacer. -- Gerry Proctor, 03/29/2004
Once you have about 1/4" of insulation you don't gain significantly more heat isolation by going thicker. There is no "one size fits all" when it comes to spacers. There are generally predicted outcomes for different spacer types but these are not absolute.
Generally, a closed spacer -where each venturi maintains a separate hole in the spacer- will improve signal to the carburetor since this spacer type lengthens the carburetor's runner and tends to improve the low rpm response. An open spacer -where all of the carburetor's venturi are open to the spacer- increase the plenum area and tend to increase the higher-end horsepower. A spacer where there is a vacuum channel between the holes doesn't make it an open spacer. It's still an isolated spacer.
Stacking spacers adds either runner length or plenum volume but there is no guaranteed outcome when you do this.
Spacers are good tuning devices and since there is no guaranteed outcome, you should treat them as tuning devices. You just have to try them and see if what happens is what you want. |
| | | RE: carb. spacer. -- metraman, 03/29/2004
thanks gerry for detailed response, my main reason for spacer is to reduce heat. i will use the closed venturi 1/2" plastic spacer w/ a 289 , 2v. alum. spacer, has a 3/8" vaccuum port, my orig. alum. 390 , 2v heat spacer. has a 5/8" vaccuum port, will my vacuum be reduced? venturi holes in manifold are same size as as 289 alum. spacer., my 390 alum. venturi holes are slightly larger, read first message. also vacuum slots in bottom ,underside of 289 alum. spacer has 1/4" notches for vacuum, where my old heat spacer has 3/8" slots for vacuum. should i notch these out to same size ?? thanks jeff |
| | | | RE: No, Jeff. -- Gerry Proctor, 03/30/2004
You don't need to do any modifications to the spacers vacuum channels or ports. From a performance perspective on the size of the bore on the spacer you'd want the spacer exit to be the same size or slightly smaller than the intake manifold's entry. Otherwise you'll have a lip on the entry transition which could upset airflow and lead to distribution and fuel drop out. This, however, is purely theoretical. It could, depending on the difference, create some intake turbulence that could be beneficial. Of course, the aluminum spacer will not provide any heat insulation. |
| Big Block ID for C6ME-A -- olddustyrelics, 03/27/2004
This engine has a 6L1 date code (12-01-66), It is in the car and running rough but it is in a 67 Fastback Mustang and obviously not original. I'm trying to figure out the correct firing order but it has an aftermarket intake. Can anyone help me ID this engine (what the hell is it? a 390 428??) It says 428 on the aircleaner but who knows. Any definitive help would be great so I can try and get this thing running, I'm pulling my hair out!! |
| | RE: Big Block ID for C6ME-A -- Paul Thompson, 03/28/2004
If it's a FE, 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8 |
| | | RE: Big Block ID for C6ME-A -- olddustyrelics, 03/28/2004
I've tried that. I've located TDC, set the dist to #1 on the cap, put the firing order to that order Starting with #1 at the passenger front cylinder 1-4 on the left bank and 5-8 on the driver's bank and still pops and spits without starting. It ran fine before winter storage, no damage, now it just does not want to start. I had it running for a short time today but it sounded like it was only running on 4 cylinders, then three then two, then quit. Can anyone help me figure this out because I am not a mechanic. |
| | | | Sounds like the carb needs attention. -- Dave Shoe, 03/28/2004
I'll bet the carb needs a quick going through. You may have a ruptured diaphragm, clogged a jet, or have a leaky float valve.
A carb rebuuild kit, disassembly, and reassembly should get you back and running.
If you can bolt on a known good carb for a few minutes, you can verify this.
Shoe. |
| | | | | RE: Sounds like the carb needs attention. -- olddustyrelics, 03/28/2004
That may be. The plugs had a heavy layer of soot on them so I replaced them. This is how I got the car to fire and run. After running about 8 miles on 6 then 5 then 4 then 3 cylinders I pulled out the new plugs and they were covered with soot too. I thought it might eb from misfiring due to imroper firing order/bad timing/dist misalignment. (I'm obviously not a mechanic but I'm trying) Does this sound like it confirms your bad Carb theory?? |
| | | | | | It's running too rich. -- Dave Shoe, 03/28/2004
The excess soot is incompletely burned gasoline. It's likely you are dumping more gasoline in than the air can burn. Either that or you filled your tank with weed killer, but I figure I'd save that option for when the carb idea didn't fix things.
I'm not a carb or timing wiz, but I'm betting everything I've got invested in my previous post that the carb is the culprit and the solution. If I'm wrong, I'll fully refund that post.
I have had problems like yours on several occasion, and swaping carbs has always worked. My 1969 351-2V Torino is presently dealing with this issue. It "loads up" and stalls when running, but it started and ran perfectly when I parked it. It's coming out of storage today, so I guess I'll see how it's acting and will probably swapping carbs again.
For some reason, I've got enough junk carbs around here that I don't need to rebuild them too often, though I do have a rebuild kit, just in case.
Good luck.
Shoe. |
| | 12-1-66 date is midyear 1967 production -- Royce, 03/28/2004
Would be an appropriate date and casting number (C6ME) for a 352, 390, 410 or 428 of the period. No way to tell one from another without measuring bore and stroke.
Royce |
| | | RE: 12-1-66 date is midyear 1967 production -- olddustyrelics, 03/28/2004
The car was built on 7/20/67. Could this be the original 390 but somebody just stuck 428 aircleaner on it?? Could a 390 be bored out to a 428 even though it is an original block to this car?? |
| | | | It's a bit early for it to be original. -- Dave Shoe, 03/28/2004
Three months is a more common date code limit for a casting in a vehicle.
A lot of folk don't understand the casting numbers on the sides of FEs from 1964-on have minimal correlation to what sand cores were stuffed into the mold. They've erroneously read the C6ME or C6ME-A always indicates a 428 block, and think they can bore it out. Unfortunately, the books are ignorant that C6ME or C6ME-A was used on all FEs and FTs thet year, though 427s did often get the more unusual C6AE-A casting mark, since the sideoiler did get different exterior detailing.
There is a small minority of 360/390/410 blocks that got 361/391/428 cylinder jackets, but since too many 390s have been overbored, it's possible you have an oinker with thin cylinders. If, however, the engine has 428 identifiers on it, or if the "drill bit test" suggests it's a 428 block, then you only need to sonic map the cylinders to be sure core shift looks good and you've got healthy cylinders.
Shoe. |
| | | | | Bad timing gears -- Dano, 03/28/2004
A lot of old FE engines used cheap aluminum timing gears with nylon teeth. It is possible your cam has slipped a few notches and that is causing your poor running condition. I had that happen once with a 390 I had, a few of the nylon gear teeth broke off and it started running very rough. |
| | | | | | That, too. -- Dave Shoe, 03/28/2004
The timing chain can lose it's teeth if it's an older nylon toothed aluminum cam gear. These gears were introduced on the 427 becuase they absorb vibration, running quiet and easing loads on the cam. They need to be replaced after 5 years or 60,000 miles though.
You can inspect the gear by removing the fuel pump and checking timing chain slop and using a flashlight to view the gear. Draining the oil may also reveal plastic chunks if it's come apart.
Shoe. |
| | | | | | | RE: That, too. -- olddustyrelics, 03/29/2004
I checked the oil and it's clean. It turned out that the bolt holding the distributor in place is a little stripped (aftermarket alum intake!) and allowed the bolt to slide up allowing the distributor to jump a tooth. After I reset the dist in it's proper place it fired up good, tweaked it a little and it ran better, but the plugs fouled out so I think I'm back with the carb again. But I got a decent burn out after it warmed up good before the plugs fouled. ;) |
| | | | | | | | RE: That, too. -- Chad Zeilenga, 03/30/2004
How do you tell if the distributor has jumped a tooth? I have heard of this before, but never knew how to check for it. I am assuming that you could bring the car up to TDC and then look to see if the distributor rotor pointed to #1. What is the position of the vacuum advance unit supposed to be? Can this be a way of telling if the distributor is positioned correctly?
Chad |
| | | | | | | | | RE: That, too. -- olddustyrelics, 03/30/2004
We had the same problem (not being mechanics and all) but the original engine came with a dist cap that had the #1 scratched into the cap instead of cast into it. So we bought a new cap that had the #1 cast into the plastic. After installing that we noticed that the rotor would point to the spark plug wire just in front of the one marked #1 at TDC on the new cap. That was our first clue. So we removed the dist and in doing so discovered we could remove it with NO TOOLS!! That's when we knew we were on to something. After resetting the dist to TDC #1 on the cap and rewiring it, it started. |
| | | | | | | | | RE: That, too. -- Paul Thompson, 03/31/2004
I would not think that the distributor actually jumped a tooth, since it would have to have come up out of the maniflod by approx on half inch, and based on how hard it is get a Ford distributor alinged with the oil pump drive, it probably wouldn't have just dropped back into place. More likely, the distributor rotated enough that it was very badly out of time. As far as the rotor pointing at the No. 1 tower, it won't, even when the timing is set correctly. The position of the rotor, relative to the tower, will depend on how much initial advance you have dialed in. There are several methods of setting timing staticly (the most accurate way), but that is outside the scope of this thread. |
| | | | | RE: It's a bit early for it to be original. -- olddustyrelics, 03/29/2004
I've read about the "drill bit test" But again, can I do that while the engine is in the car? And exactly where do I stick the drill bit for comparison? |
| | | | | | The drill bit test is a bit controversial. -- Dave Shoe, 04/01/2004
I'm backing away from my drill bit test concept for now, as I'm learning from too many it's not what a lot of folk are looking for. Others are developing an upgrade to the test, and it'll likely mature and appear in posts as time permits.
Shoe. |
| Date Code On '67 XL 428 Car? -- XL428, 03/27/2004
I believe my car has the original 428, but looking at the date code on my engine (near the oil filter, underneath), it's 6H5. I think that means August 5, 1966. Is that too early for a 1967 Ford? The last 6 digits of my VIN are 159274. Please let me know what you think... |
| | What is the build date for the car? -- Royce, 03/28/2004
Engines were sometimes built in batches and pushed into storage areas so the last motor in might be the first out and vice - versa. 1967 production of cars began July 4, 1966 so engines had to be ready well before that date.
Your engine would surely have been installed in a 1967 Ford or Mercury, it was cast well after 1966 production ended. It could have been installed in anything made prior to about December 1966 using common sense and logic.
Royce |
| block I.D. -- mike, 03/27/2004
Can anyone tell me what engine this block # is,and what vehicle it may have come from. 8R115157
thanks |
| | It is.... -- Royce, 03/27/2004
8 = Year, 1968 R = San Jose assembly plant 115157 = Assembly number, sequential VIN
So your engine is from a car assembled during the 1968 model year in the San Jose plant. No other data can be obtained from just the number.
You can contact Kevin Marti and pay $25 to find out the rest of the story on that particular car but it is probably a lot easier to just measure the bore and stroke.
Royce |
| | That just says its from a '68 Mustang or Cougar, #8Rxxx115157. [n/m] -- Mr F, 03/29/2004
n/m |
| hard starting -- 69 fairlane cobra, 03/26/2004
When I try to start the car cold with a fresh battery it fires right up. When it heats up the starter acts like is dragging or "popping" somehow? Then after about 4 starts it wont crank at all. The whole motor is fresh with new starter, celenoid, starter relay, and regulator. Need help please.....Dave |
| | RE: hard starting -- Steve M, 03/27/2004
Are your headers real close to your starter? Sometimes the header heat will make it drag or use more power to start I think. |
| | | RE: hard starting -- 69 fairlane cobra, 03/27/2004
No, I do have the original manifols on, and they are very close to the starter. It is pretty much a original 428 cobra jet set up. Would this make the starter "buck" when I try to crank it cold? Thanks for the help Steve |
| | | | Pretty normal, nowadays. -- Dave Shoe, 03/27/2004
I've never had any luck in recent years with stock starters in a performance FE application. Many others have complained just the same.
I've tried the fancy NAPA "Raylock" guaranteed starter rebuilds, as well as their plain rebuilds. Also tried rebuilds from other parts stores.
All crank nice when cols, dead slow when engine warmed. Lifespan is typically a year.
My method for starting when warm (using an 850DP Holley) is to pump the gas pedal about 5 times until it floods and crank the engine. It'll crank slow for one turn, then spin fast about 3 turns and fires up fine. The problem is apaprently that first slow turn is really hard on the starters, and soon the starters go bad. The failures do not follow any trend, each seems to be different -causing me to try another rebuild.
Note that I run heavy gauge cabling and high amp batterys, so electrical insufficiency is not the issue. One rumor is that rebuilders use less copper nowadays. Maybe that's true, I don't know. Maybe modern gasoline is blended for computerized spark timing, allowing more volatiles that fire better on cool days, but don't ping in hot weather because computers adjust the timing.
There are a number of possibilities, but I haven't pinpoionted any culprit.
There are two solutions: Either get an ignition delay or mini-starter. Or both.
The fancier MSD spark amplifiers (series 7??) offer a spark retard when the starter cranks. I don't know if this is desirable when cold, but it sure makes hot cranking easy and generally works when cold. I believe the Duraspark era Ford ignition may have had a model or two with a starter retard, but Duraspark is not an ignition amplifier like and MSD, it only offers normal spark energy as regulated (limited) by the ballast. Either should work well in your case (it's easy and cheap to stick common 302 Duraspark distributor guts into the FE points distributor), and the Duraspark amplifier is easier to hide.
High Torque ministarters are the most common solution. I made the mistake of buying a McLeod ministarter a few years back, and it did NOT fit with Hooker headers on a FE Galaxie, FE Fairlane, or Fe Mustang. It would probably have fit stock manifolds, but I returned it to Summit after a year of no luck, and they happily accepted it. I haven't yet spend on a new starter, haven't been driving a performance FE in years since I'm spending my money collecting factory FE engine blueprints and literature, but next build of mine gets a ministarter. Powermaster seems to get good reviews, as do a number of other brands. Check Jegs or Summit (avoid purchasing from PAW!) and you should be in good shape.
Shoe. |
| | | | RE: hard starting -- giacamo, 03/27/2004
do a starter amp check wen cold and hot and a voltage test wial cranking i,v had to take back even new batteries that wer not up to snuf and check your batterie with a hydramenter. for spicific graviety on all the cells thease tests may help pinpoint your proublems...... |
| | RE: hard starting -- Steve, 03/27/2004
I had a similar problem with my 428. After changing the starter twice with rebuilt stock starters I went to a high torque starter and added a heat shield in 2001. I have not had a problem since.
Steve |
| Fan Shroud -- Tim P., 03/26/2004
Guys Does any body have or know of where i can locate a fan shroud for my 390 truck it has heavy cooling this radiator is massive in my 72. Thanks in advance, Tim. |
| | did you try Dennis Carpenter? n/m -- Barry B, 03/26/2004
n/m |
| FE Cylinder Head I.D. -- Lucas, 03/25/2004
cast iron heads off 390
casting# C8AE-H
Anyone know what these are? |
| | RE: FE Cylinder Head I.D. -- jack ross, 03/25/2004
according to my books, you have 1968 390 heads with 2.02 intake valves, 1.55 exhaust valves and 68.1-71.1cc combustion chambers. intake port dimensions at manifold mounting face measure 2.26 by 1.34 inches. nothing special but, due to a high nickel content in the casting, it should resist warping and cracking and prove to be a good, reliable set of heads. |
| | | RE: FE Cylinder Head I.D. -- Lucas, 03/25/2004
Thanks Jack. I pulled these from a 390 engine that's being built for my Midstates Cobra. I'm not going to use them on my FE, but wanted to give prospective buyers an idea of what they were. |
| | | | RE: Run of the mill head. -- Gerry Proctor, 03/26/2004
Used on any FE (GT Mustang, 2bbl Galaxy, truck...) that wasn't a 427 or 428CJ/SCJ.
Nothing wrong with them but they're nothing special. The only difference (beyond the springs used for the GT cars) among the C8AE-H heads is the exhaust bolt pattern. Eight-bolt heads were used in everything that wasn't a Mustang or Fairlane/Torino, which used the unibody 14-bolt pattern.
They are so common that they are hard to sell for more than it costs to ship them if you're thinking of the ebay route. |
| | | | | It's the standard FE head for 1968-71. -- Dave Shoe, 03/27/2004
Avoid the books, since they've all mixed together the 6090 casting numbers with 6049 assembly numbers. The text is pure pollution.
C8AE-H was found on nearly all 1968-72 FEs, the exception being some early 1968s got C7AE-A and C8ae castings, the CJ got the C80E-N, and the D2TE-AA was phased in during 1972 as the Michigan Casting Center came on line.
As Gerry mentioned, you can find C8AE-H heads drilled for the 8-bolt vertical exhaust of Galaxies and pickups, or the 14-bolt diagonal exhaut of the Fairlane/Mustang. All are the same casting.
The casting is a good, efficient, common one. They performed great on everything from 360 pickups to 428PIs. The D2TE-AA is about identical, and many 1966-67 FE heads are quite similar to the C8AE-H, varying primarily in combustion chamber shape.
All C8AE-H castings have the Thermactor bosses cast in. Some C8AE-H heads will be drilled for Thermactor (GT, PI, and it was a $46 option on any FE because some minicipalities in CA apparently required this option).
Note that Hooker car headers do NOT port match this head, since it's got the repositioned port. Search the forum for "port mismatch" or "gasket leak" for more info. FPA (www.fordpowertrain.com) makes headers that match, and Hooker truck headers are rumored to match.
Shoe. |
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