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Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12394&Reply=12394><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>My chance on a 63 lightweight</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>David Thayer, <i>04/02/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>It was 1979, a guy here locally named John Handy had a little car lot down the street from where I worked.  The car was an absolutley pristtine 63 White/Red 427 Lightweight, everything there, everything stock, had about 7500 miles on it.  <br>He was asking $4500.  I went to one of our local banks, F&M bank and trust and tried to get a loan. The loan officer, Tom Sumner told me I was nuts wanting to borrow $4500 for a 63 Galaxie.  He said he would be glad to loan me money for a NEW car but $4500 for this thing!!  When I told him more about it, he said it sounded like something that had been all chopped up and that I should be glad I came to him as he could keep me from being 'Suckered" in by this used car salesman.<br>I didn't get the car! </blockquote> My chance on a 63 lightweight -- David Thayer, 04/02/2002
It was 1979, a guy here locally named John Handy had a little car lot down the street from where I worked. The car was an absolutley pristtine 63 White/Red 427 Lightweight, everything there, everything stock, had about 7500 miles on it.
He was asking $4500. I went to one of our local banks, F&M bank and trust and tried to get a loan. The loan officer, Tom Sumner told me I was nuts wanting to borrow $4500 for a 63 Galaxie. He said he would be glad to loan me money for a NEW car but $4500 for this thing!! When I told him more about it, he said it sounded like something that had been all chopped up and that I should be glad I came to him as he could keep me from being 'Suckered" in by this used car salesman.
I didn't get the car!
 RE: My chance on a 63 lightweight -- Mac, 04/02/2002
i hate banks and people who dont understand cars
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12397&Reply=12394><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>RE: My chance on a 63 lightweight</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>hawkrod, <i>04/03/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>i had a similar one in '84. a local high end lot had a GT40. i had an inheritance and was spending like a mad man (bought 5 big block cars and was still looking). i went to look at the car and they pooh poohed me because i was so young. i went and got a cashiers check for 20K and they let me drive it. went home to think about it and talk to my dad. i thought he was going to have a coronary on the spot. he turned red and tore up my check and screamed for a week. i felt like a 5 year old who had done wrong! the car had track history but was not much of a winner but i liked it and of course now it is a million dollar car. i count this as the biggest fish i never caught. the up side is i drove it and that is a memory i will have forever. hawkrod </blockquote> RE: My chance on a 63 lightweight -- hawkrod, 04/03/2002
i had a similar one in '84. a local high end lot had a GT40. i had an inheritance and was spending like a mad man (bought 5 big block cars and was still looking). i went to look at the car and they pooh poohed me because i was so young. i went and got a cashiers check for 20K and they let me drive it. went home to think about it and talk to my dad. i thought he was going to have a coronary on the spot. he turned red and tore up my check and screamed for a week. i felt like a 5 year old who had done wrong! the car had track history but was not much of a winner but i liked it and of course now it is a million dollar car. i count this as the biggest fish i never caught. the up side is i drove it and that is a memory i will have forever. hawkrod
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12398&Reply=12394><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>RE: My chance on a 63 lightweight</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>David Thayer, <i>04/03/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>Wow, a GT40, I got to sit in the MKIV on display at the World's Fair in San Antonio in 1968. </blockquote> RE: My chance on a 63 lightweight -- David Thayer, 04/03/2002
Wow, a GT40, I got to sit in the MKIV on display at the World's Fair in San Antonio in 1968.
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12402&Reply=12394><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>RE: My chance on a 63 lightweight</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Bob H., <i>04/03/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>Talking about GT-40's way backin 1966-67 I stopped in at a little Ford dealer in Abilene Texas {Iwas stationed there AirForce base} a guy working for Shelby was taking a GT40 around to  Ford dealers for display,got to talking to him showed him my 1956 Fairlane  with 427" engine sitting outside,spent most of Saturday there got a ride in parking lot,salemmen were trying to talk him into taking a blast down street they would not go for paying his tickets so he declined   I would haved that ride    </blockquote> RE: My chance on a 63 lightweight -- Bob H., 04/03/2002
Talking about GT-40's way backin 1966-67 I stopped in at a little Ford dealer in Abilene Texas {Iwas stationed there AirForce base} a guy working for Shelby was taking a GT40 around to Ford dealers for display,got to talking to him showed him my 1956 Fairlane with 427" engine sitting outside,spent most of Saturday there got a ride in parking lot,salemmen were trying to talk him into taking a blast down street they would not go for paying his tickets so he declined I would haved that ride
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12413&Reply=12394><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>RE: My chance on a 63 lightweight</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Chuck, <i>04/03/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>Hey David, did you follow up on the banker? He may have a 63 Lightweight in his garage!<br> </blockquote> RE: My chance on a 63 lightweight -- Chuck, 04/03/2002
Hey David, did you follow up on the banker? He may have a 63 Lightweight in his garage!
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12414&Reply=12394><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>lightweight clone for sale</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>KevinT, <i>04/03/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>I didn't see a classified area on this forum. But, thought I'd mention that I'm putting up my 63 1/2 Galaxie Lightweight Clone. Rust Free Georgia Car, Black on Black, Bostrom Buckets, Factory Frt Aluminum Bumper, Teardrop Fiberglass Hood, 427 Professionally Rebuilt with approx. 1000 miles on it. New suspension,brakes,steering components,exhaust (with cutouts), Reinforced Powder Coated Rear Housing with Strange N case, 35 spline Billet Locker, 4:71 Gears. Lexan Windshield. C-6 CJ, 3000 A-1 Stall. No roll bar. Very Clean and looks period correct. Street/Strip. Much more... $24,000 or best. I know its not $4,000 like the lightweight you had a chance to buy, but parts aren't cheap anymore as you know! email kmt@tir.com </blockquote> lightweight clone for sale -- KevinT, 04/03/2002
I didn't see a classified area on this forum. But, thought I'd mention that I'm putting up my 63 1/2 Galaxie Lightweight Clone. Rust Free Georgia Car, Black on Black, Bostrom Buckets, Factory Frt Aluminum Bumper, Teardrop Fiberglass Hood, 427 Professionally Rebuilt with approx. 1000 miles on it. New suspension,brakes,steering components,exhaust (with cutouts), Reinforced Powder Coated Rear Housing with Strange N case, 35 spline Billet Locker, 4:71 Gears. Lexan Windshield. C-6 CJ, 3000 A-1 Stall. No roll bar. Very Clean and looks period correct. Street/Strip. Much more... $24,000 or best. I know its not $4,000 like the lightweight you had a chance to buy, but parts aren't cheap anymore as you know! email kmt@tir.com
 RE: lightweight clone for sale -- KevinT, 04/03/2002
Sorry for the classified post on here, I just saw the classified section to the left. My apologies
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12423&Reply=12394><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>RE: My chance on a 63 lightweight</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>David Thayer, <i>04/04/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>I wish, no, you would have to know this guy, typical banker in the 70's, black horn rim glasses, slicked back hair, cheap suit with lots of dandruff! </blockquote> RE: My chance on a 63 lightweight -- David Thayer, 04/04/2002
I wish, no, you would have to know this guy, typical banker in the 70's, black horn rim glasses, slicked back hair, cheap suit with lots of dandruff!
 I got a chance like that and just happened to... -- James, 04/05/2002
Have the cash on me. It was a 70 Boss 302. There was a cashier at a local convienience store that loved to play bingo. The bingo hall owner and his wife had a falling out over the car so he put it in as the grand prize that night. The cashier won the car and drove it home that night. It had carberator trouble that her shade tree buddies couldn't figure out so she became scared of what it was going to take to fix it. I offered her $2800 for it and she took it. I turned around and put it in the paper and tripled my money. The car had lots going wrong with it so I bailed on it but wisely.
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12393&Reply=12393><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>C6AE-R heads and cam selection</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Matt, <i>04/02/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>hello, I ve posted earlier asking about converting my heads to cobra jet specs using the 2.09 / 1.87? valve sizes. to use on a 66 428 engine from a t-bird.  What cam specs would be good for me.  engine is for street use with a possible trip or two the the strip.  My heads have the adjustable rocker assembly.  Can I retain this with solid lifters, or must I keep the stock hydraulics.  the block is being milled .30 over.  Ideas for pistons?<br>Im not looking to break the bank either. thanks </blockquote> C6AE-R heads and cam selection -- Matt, 04/02/2002
hello, I ve posted earlier asking about converting my heads to cobra jet specs using the 2.09 / 1.87? valve sizes. to use on a 66 428 engine from a t-bird. What cam specs would be good for me. engine is for street use with a possible trip or two the the strip. My heads have the adjustable rocker assembly. Can I retain this with solid lifters, or must I keep the stock hydraulics. the block is being milled .30 over. Ideas for pistons?
Im not looking to break the bank either. thanks
 RE: C6AE-R heads and cam selection -- Derek66, 04/03/2002
You can certainly fit the CJ-sized valves (2.09" Int/1.66" Exh) into your heads, while you're having them freshened up. You'll want to ensure that the seats are done correctly for use with today's fuels, and that a good 3-angle valve job is done. Valve springs should be upgraded to something compatible with the new camshaft.

As for your rocker arm assemblies, yes you must keep the hydraulic lifters with your non-adjustables. But you should also carefully inspect them for wear, cracks, etc. first. If they fail inspection, or you really want to run solids, buy a set of the adjustable rocker assemblies and the matching pushrods, and you'll have the flexibility to go either way with a cam. However, there's little reason for most people to run solids on a medium performance street motor, with so many good hydraulic profiles and components available nowadays.

For your application, in order to properly recommend a camshaft choice, we'd need to know things like vehicle model, curb weight, rear end gear ratio, and whether or not it's an automatic transmission. Also things like whether headers and low-restriction exhaust will be used, what intake manifold and carburetion are on the car, and whether you intend to upgrade any of the internal engine components, like stronger rods, forged pistons, etc. On any FE rebuild, I'd recommend having the rods fitted with premium rod bolts (like ARP), and having oiling system modifications done, including opening up and aligning critical passages, and the addition of a quality HV pump.

If you're looking to just do a 'stock' type rebuild on your 428, but want something a little stronger, I'd be looking for a dual-pattern camshaft in the 215 Int/225 Exh (duration @ .050"), .490" - .520" lift range. Like the original CJ camshaft, this will give you strong low-to-mid-range torque, and 6,000 RPM capability, respecting the limits of your non-SCJ internals.

The Ford C6AZ-H (428 Police Interceptor) intake manifold, or something similar (dual plane design), along with a 650-750cfm carburetor, will work well with your modified heads and this type of camshaft.

If you're NOT using headers, and don't have some of the better Ford exhaust manifolds (427/428CJ), you're going to bottleneck what could be a good powerplant. It has to be able to breathe 'out' as well as 'in'. And that means all the way to the rear bumper too.

For the pistons, consider the Keith Black/Silv-O-lite hypereutectics. They're an excellent piston, and come in very nicely between the prices for standard cast designs (which there aren't that many of these days for the 428s) and forged pistons.
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12391&Reply=12391><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>Just blew my water pump, any ideas!?</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>rkutzner, <i>04/02/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>Fired up the ol' 428 today and after running for about 15 minutes, blew the rear gasket (behind the impellor) of the new water pump at around 4000 rpm?  Bad gasket or is there some condition that could cause that to happen?  </blockquote> Just blew my water pump, any ideas!? -- rkutzner, 04/02/2002
Fired up the ol' 428 today and after running for about 15 minutes, blew the rear gasket (behind the impellor) of the new water pump at around 4000 rpm? Bad gasket or is there some condition that could cause that to happen?
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12399&Reply=12391><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>RE: Just blew my water pump, any ideas!?</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Gerry Proctor, <i>04/03/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>I would say it was a bad gasket or poor quality control on the assembly line.  High pump pressure theorectically could do this, but you'd have to block both outlets and spin the pump up to fairly high rpm and have a marginal gasket seal.  I really doubt that all of these things could coincide.  Since the gasket is dead, remove the rear plate and inspect the plate for any signs of contact.  Otherswise, make sure the plate is flat, put in a new gasket and call it good. </blockquote> RE: Just blew my water pump, any ideas!? -- Gerry Proctor, 04/03/2002
I would say it was a bad gasket or poor quality control on the assembly line. High pump pressure theorectically could do this, but you'd have to block both outlets and spin the pump up to fairly high rpm and have a marginal gasket seal. I really doubt that all of these things could coincide. Since the gasket is dead, remove the rear plate and inspect the plate for any signs of contact. Otherswise, make sure the plate is flat, put in a new gasket and call it good.
 RE: That's what FlowKooler said......but.... -- rkutzner, 04/03/2002
The rep I talked to also thought they had 'changed that gasket' recently leading me to believe it may have been a recurring problem with that pump. They are sending me new gaskets (improved?). Anyways, had one of those on a 390 for over 6 years before I sold the car and never had a problem so I'm chalking it up to a fluke.......

Thanks for the feedback!
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12382&Reply=12382><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>390/406 shorty exhaust manifold port size</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>TODD NOVAK, <i>04/01/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>I'm looking for the port size on the 390/406 shorty exhaust manifolds. <br>I've read that the FE heads from the early '60's all have the same exhaust port size (1.84 x 1.28). Do the exhaust manifolds match this size or is there another port size that they match? </blockquote> 390/406 shorty exhaust manifold port size -- TODD NOVAK, 04/01/2002
I'm looking for the port size on the 390/406 shorty exhaust manifolds.
I've read that the FE heads from the early '60's all have the same exhaust port size (1.84 x 1.28). Do the exhaust manifolds match this size or is there another port size that they match?
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12384&Reply=12382><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>RE: 390/406 shorty exhaust manifold port size</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Bob, <i>04/01/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>Just measured a C0AE-9430-B and the ports are 2-3/32 H by 1-13/32 W (2.09 x1.40).   I don't think they've been ported but ... </blockquote> RE: 390/406 shorty exhaust manifold port size -- Bob, 04/01/2002
Just measured a C0AE-9430-B and the ports are 2-3/32 H by 1-13/32 W (2.09 x1.40). I don't think they've been ported but ...
 RE: 390/406 shorty exhaust manifold port size -- TODD NOVAK, 04/02/2002
Bob, thanks for the help!
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12371&Reply=12371><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>motor info?</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Rui, <i>03/31/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>I have a 1968 thunderbird 76000 km (original)<br>I would like to know what motor (cid) it has<br>serial# 8y84n151818 thanks </blockquote> motor info? -- Rui, 03/31/2002
I have a 1968 thunderbird 76000 km (original)
I would like to know what motor (cid) it has
serial# 8y84n151818 thanks
 The 'N' in your VIN = 429 4v; 360bhp @ 2600rpm. [n/m] -- Mr F, 03/31/2002
n/m
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12368&Reply=12368><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>Factory cam specs</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Derek66, <i>03/30/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>There was some discussion awhile back, about the actual cam specs for the 390GT/428CJ engines. I dug REAL deep into an old pile of info and papers, and found some notes I made from 83/03/07. Since Forum members were also interested in comparing aftermarket cams and copies of the CJ, I thought it might pay to post them.<br><br>This was a 64,000 mile used CJ cam (C6OZ-6250-B), in reasonably good condition.<br><br>[@ .050" lifter rise] <br>Int.Open @ 11-1/2° ATC - Int.Close @ 40-1/2° ABC<br>Exh.Open @ 48-1/2° BBC - Exh. Close @ 6-1/2° BTC<br><br>Duration @ .050" = 209°INT / 222° EXH<br><br>Lobe Lift :  .265"/INT, .269"/EXH (.458"/.465" @ 1.73)<br><br>LSA = 115.5°<br><br>C/L = 116°/INT, 115°/EXH<br><br><br>We can compare this with Lunati's published specs for their 'Blueprinted' stock cam:<br><br>Gross Duration:  304°/INT, 324°/EXH<br><br>Duration @ .050": 224°/INT, 232°/EXH<br><br>Gross Lift: .481"/INT, .490"/EXH<br><br>LSA = 114°<br><br>Just for interest' sake, here's the specs from a Cam Dynamics 428CJ #CJN-2 NHRA Stock Eliminator 'Cheater' Cam:<br><br>[@ .050" lifter rise] <br>Int.Open @ 9° BTC - Int.Close @ 59° ABC<br>Exh.Open @ 67-1/2° BBC - Exh. Close @ 20-1/2° ATC<br><br>Duration @ .050" = 248°INT / 268° EXH<br><br>Lobe Lift :  .275"/INT, .283"/EXH (.475"/.489" @ 1.73)<br><br>LSA = 113°<br><br>C/L = 115°/INT, 111°/EXH<br><br>From an old Crane Cams catalog article, here are specs on some other Ford engines:<br><br>[289CID - 2/4 Bbl]<br>      Advertised Duration: 284°/INT, 258°/EXH<br>      Duration @ .050" lift: 182°/INT, 180°/EXH<br>      Gross lift: .368"/INT, .380"/EXH<br><br>[289HP]<br>      Advertised Duration: 362° INT & EXH<br>      Duration @ .050" lift: 232° INT & EXH<br>      Gross lift: .478"<br><br>[351W (1969/70)]<br>      Advertised Duration: 303°/INT, 317°/EXH<br>      Duration @ .050" lift: 189°/INT, 190°/EXH<br>      Gross lift: .425"/INT, .450"/EXH<br><br>[427MR]<br>      Advertised Duration: 358° INT & EXH<br>      Duration @ .050" lift: 228° INT & EXH<br>      Gross lift: .525" INT & EXH<br><br>[429 SCJ]<br>      Advertised Duration: 385° INT & EXH<br>      Duration @ .050" lift: 232° INT & EXH<br>      Gross lift: .515" INT & EXH<br><br>[429/460]<br>      Advertised Duration: 290°/INT, 304°/EXH<br>      Duration @ .050" lift: 190°/INT, 202°/EXH<br>      Gross lift: .443"/INT, .487"/EXH </blockquote> Factory cam specs -- Derek66, 03/30/2002
There was some discussion awhile back, about the actual cam specs for the 390GT/428CJ engines. I dug REAL deep into an old pile of info and papers, and found some notes I made from 83/03/07. Since Forum members were also interested in comparing aftermarket cams and copies of the CJ, I thought it might pay to post them.

This was a 64,000 mile used CJ cam (C6OZ-6250-B), in reasonably good condition.

[@ .050" lifter rise]
Int.Open @ 11-1/2° ATC - Int.Close @ 40-1/2° ABC
Exh.Open @ 48-1/2° BBC - Exh. Close @ 6-1/2° BTC

Duration @ .050" = 209°INT / 222° EXH

Lobe Lift : .265"/INT, .269"/EXH (.458"/.465" @ 1.73)

LSA = 115.5°

C/L = 116°/INT, 115°/EXH


We can compare this with Lunati's published specs for their 'Blueprinted' stock cam:

Gross Duration: 304°/INT, 324°/EXH

Duration @ .050": 224°/INT, 232°/EXH

Gross Lift: .481"/INT, .490"/EXH

LSA = 114°

Just for interest' sake, here's the specs from a Cam Dynamics 428CJ #CJN-2 NHRA Stock Eliminator 'Cheater' Cam:

[@ .050" lifter rise]
Int.Open @ 9° BTC - Int.Close @ 59° ABC
Exh.Open @ 67-1/2° BBC - Exh. Close @ 20-1/2° ATC

Duration @ .050" = 248°INT / 268° EXH

Lobe Lift : .275"/INT, .283"/EXH (.475"/.489" @ 1.73)

LSA = 113°

C/L = 115°/INT, 111°/EXH

From an old Crane Cams catalog article, here are specs on some other Ford engines:

[289CID - 2/4 Bbl]
Advertised Duration: 284°/INT, 258°/EXH
Duration @ .050" lift: 182°/INT, 180°/EXH
Gross lift: .368"/INT, .380"/EXH

[289HP]
Advertised Duration: 362° INT & EXH
Duration @ .050" lift: 232° INT & EXH
Gross lift: .478"

[351W (1969/70)]
Advertised Duration: 303°/INT, 317°/EXH
Duration @ .050" lift: 189°/INT, 190°/EXH
Gross lift: .425"/INT, .450"/EXH

[427MR]
Advertised Duration: 358° INT & EXH
Duration @ .050" lift: 228° INT & EXH
Gross lift: .525" INT & EXH

[429 SCJ]
Advertised Duration: 385° INT & EXH
Duration @ .050" lift: 232° INT & EXH
Gross lift: .515" INT & EXH

[429/460]
Advertised Duration: 290°/INT, 304°/EXH
Duration @ .050" lift: 190°/INT, 202°/EXH
Gross lift: .443"/INT, .487"/EXH
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12373&Reply=12368><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>Very interesting info, Derek. Thanks.  :-) [n/m]</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Mr F, <i>03/31/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>n/m </blockquote> Very interesting info, Derek. Thanks. :-) [n/m] -- Mr F, 03/31/2002
n/m
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12375&Reply=12368><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>The MR specs from Crane are wrong....</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>kevin, <i>04/01/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>but that is not the first time that misinformation has been published. The real cams out of mine are the 306 original's. </blockquote> The MR specs from Crane are wrong.... -- kevin, 04/01/2002
but that is not the first time that misinformation has been published. The real cams out of mine are the 306 original's.
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12381&Reply=12368><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>RE: The MR specs from Crane are wrong....</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Derek66, <i>04/01/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>I don't doubt it, Kevin. But these specs are similar to NHRA's 'legal' specs, and no doubt reflect the .002: checking clearance used.<br><br>I think it'd be fair to say that Ford supplied, shall we say, 'questionably accurate' info on some of their parts, in order to make their engines more competitive in racing. </blockquote> RE: The MR specs from Crane are wrong.... -- Derek66, 04/01/2002
I don't doubt it, Kevin. But these specs are similar to NHRA's 'legal' specs, and no doubt reflect the .002: checking clearance used.

I think it'd be fair to say that Ford supplied, shall we say, 'questionably accurate' info on some of their parts, in order to make their engines more competitive in racing.
 I've posted them before... -- kevin, 04/02/2002
but here goes: the 352-390-406 Hi Per cam was 228 duration at .050, the 1-4v 427 (306) was 236, the 2-4v (324) was 244. The MR came out and recieved the 306 instead of the 324, due to the fact that the power went up, and they could get away with less cam timing for the same power (they really made about 440). These were all on 114 lobe centers for good vacuum and drivability. Dont confuse the over the counter "LeMans" or it's C4AE-B #, as it has a 106 L/C and was not designed for drivability. The .600 lift "Daytona" cam had 275 @ .050 on 108 L/C FYI too. I know what you are trying to say about the "cheater" grinds though, as they generally have more lift than stockers due to deflection in the valvetrain not letting them exceed published specs and are scrutinized very carefully.
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12365&Reply=12365><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>Installing a 427 Intake manifold on a 390 engine</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Terry Emo, <i>03/30/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>Has anyone installed a 427 Intake manifold (Part# C3AE 9425 J) on a 390 4v engine?  I believe the intake came of a '63 Galaxy.  What problems will I have?  Can I use the stock heads?  Do I need to use bigger valves to handle the increased CFM of the 2-4bbl carbs ?  Thanks!! </blockquote> Installing a 427 Intake manifold on a 390 engine -- Terry Emo, 03/30/2002
Has anyone installed a 427 Intake manifold (Part# C3AE 9425 J) on a 390 4v engine? I believe the intake came of a '63 Galaxy. What problems will I have? Can I use the stock heads? Do I need to use bigger valves to handle the increased CFM of the 2-4bbl carbs ? Thanks!!
 RE: Installing a 427 Intake manifold on a 390 engine -- David Thayer, 03/31/2002
As long as the heads and intake have not been milled, you should not have any problems bolting everything up. The hardest part is getting the cast iron beast off!!, You may consider using an engine lift!

What size carbs will you use? With all of these carbs it will be easy to get it way too rich. You may need to do some serious tunign on the carbs.
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12376&Reply=12365><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>RE: Installing a 427 Intake manifold on a 390 engine</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Terry Emo, <i>04/01/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>David;<br><br>It looks like the 2 carbs on the manifold are Holley 4160's.  Don't know what jets etc. they have. </blockquote> RE: Installing a 427 Intake manifold on a 390 engine -- Terry Emo, 04/01/2002
David;

It looks like the 2 carbs on the manifold are Holley 4160's. Don't know what jets etc. they have.
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12379&Reply=12365><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>Can you post the Ford IDs or list # from those carbs? [n/m]</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Mr F, <i>04/01/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>n/m </blockquote> Can you post the Ford IDs or list # from those carbs? [n/m] -- Mr F, 04/01/2002
n/m
 RE: Can you post the Ford IDs or list # from those carbs? [n/m] -- Terry Emo, 04/02/2002
Yes, I'll try to get those numbers posted by tomorrow
 Here are the list & part numbers for carbs -- Terry Emo, 04/03/2002
Mr F.............

The list# is 2652-1, part# C3AE 9510 C Hope this is what you need.
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12364&Reply=12364><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>Bellhousing ?</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Aaronhead, <i>03/30/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>Will a truck bellhousing work with a toploader. </blockquote> Bellhousing ? -- Aaronhead, 03/30/2002
Will a truck bellhousing work with a toploader.
 RE: Bellhousing ? -- dean, 03/31/2002
no
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12363&Reply=12363><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>Motor</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>gouge, <i>03/30/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>Wanted to see if there is a way to tell a 289 from a 302 without tearing her apart.  I broke a rocker arm. Any reason this would happen besides age? Wasn't sure how to get it back on correctly.  Any hints?  Wanted to make sure it wasn't adjustable.The push rod is O.K.<br><br>Thanks Much,<br><br>Andy Gouge </blockquote> Motor -- gouge, 03/30/2002
Wanted to see if there is a way to tell a 289 from a 302 without tearing her apart. I broke a rocker arm. Any reason this would happen besides age? Wasn't sure how to get it back on correctly. Any hints? Wanted to make sure it wasn't adjustable.The push rod is O.K.

Thanks Much,

Andy Gouge
 Heads -- Ed Foral, 03/30/2002
If you pull a valve cover, you should see if your heads are 289 or 302, as either a 302 or 289 should be cast there. Also, the casting date of the heads will be there, and it can be compared with the assembly date stamped on the front of the engine. The block casting number is behind the starter to see if it is a 289 or 302 block.
None of this will prove if a 289 or 302 crank is in the block, but you may infer it.

Ed
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12351&Reply=12351><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>8 Bolt C80E-N head, picture.</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Royce Peterson, <i>03/29/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>Late service replacement for 427 Low Riser. This one has a 1969 casting date.<br><br>Royce Peterson<br><br>[Image edited for size by Admin.] <br /><img 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Mjil5LSIMoVpMPsMj83wKMi1lrcKz+jIf7zjPY0fCqCCeNsUrJAluBKoy8LByrcjG/FWl/BHC7NCWaPYYaspQdUJjmMfIABFVoDAjGcdgKtOsgI9uwGGKlTvzvtSEbMuOwB270kndlgygAnakGct+UnbzVlc5Lk4yKTMe4GDufFdOKRgQ6tZJ4obzMxG3HzRZo2jiwAck8/FJxxys2TnY1A3bjW5+e1Tu3OBH2xvRbW3YAuVGBwMZockTySHA+2apUVW3Zt1BwO9WNhaCQ5YjIO2aAqaUx/NTNo38ZRxiildC2REBLDV4HejsQrLGrk4G4IwQaXGzBTwRkUTCruBg+ayBXf27n9qrnVSHyxAG4Hmn43ifYgkefmoTxRIhbI2qWKd8o2Rn7itzdMe5jEphbSP5gKsYoFcamUaicha1LJIg0q5A8ZrUqxUCzljQiONh481XP06ZNTOjKWJJOOK6RbwMPTmU6huMUWO4gOr1FZlIxzTuLI4r8CHyM4K8V2P9m6tHfdVj/Mwhj1Hxuapr2AQzGSEMI87giun/s9tgsXVb5QMTSpED50Df8A1rf/AJcbPXXaJP8AGf2rKJg+B+1ZXNrI8sayB2AGaD+FRdQOrOe5q5ZDIDQnjXkBRjtWZXRVemIydRO/APesQYOCmF806wOo6cZ+RQpVQD2kmnYtL+sokIJHt5GeaFPeaIT2A3G9JXUKevqT2MNyxrLeB76dFz/DU5bPetTwHOj2LXLqZSfTzrb5+K6tAgXbZft4pC3jSBdsKqnjFTe41nSB7QaxVvhz12L6YwSTyRwKPFGHjyP4owc4pFJ5BGB6YCDkjkj70wt7mPSkIjUcYaiBzfXPrDplhJLZ2cFzdMdIc240jIOTuRTX0/8AUNv125/Dw217b3UQMgSV+w7ginYbeMDGiM4G2NiaFEGS41xwMhOVABGrA5rVxYvLm4uIrV3dSQdm1bk7Ed9+9NGRZ+nW8obcouRzvXMXNzNIunRKUB3B5p/oV7+Itbm1ZShixLHkcjuKz1MuIXp/FOFXOI9s/NLNasR+fHzVtHbIiFR55rDAAOKNxqKNoBnC4J+a2kKJnJOatjbI3C8UJ7VAcD9qZVilukZpBlsYHOKFBaeochgG+asbiPMgDAGgGJQc71qUe/h6GFFUIQDgVprMAExrg/PFLxB0JKk/FOpNJ6RJBb4oSsktijg6TseDRLeECTJXGDnIpuc4CMGGSOMcUOE6X3wRxjimL4MHbU2OAP60NZ1VmLt2xgVokAYGxHNVwdWuPz+2rB9OqXZda5GO/ij2sTOdUrE481kJLroG64/emkCxQlHYIOcVYUW1EnBIUUCUrIQAPfxgVMTrIyouUVjgse1dDa2VjbqSs8czj5xRLItVEHQZJV1SvpwM7itS9LtbcNruyq84wDj9aousvedZvZIpLye3tUcqsULadWO5NZ0vo6RzehbLKImHvMj5/qaaLM/Vhe2Cf9OllSTVpU48E4rovoi3W2+i+mFVw06NO/8A5MaS6itvF0qWISR4CYVQe9M/RXUEu/p2K0Q4m6exidR/hySp/YinjfxnlHSaT4b9qypC7nx/eP8AvWUsPPGBA07Y+DQJQsa6mI+wpvAVCTnA8UjM3u9Q5Zuwrm60pNcSH+7hH/scVXy3ckbaZIsoOdDZx80S+uRHjOGb5PFIRW13enJjWOMf/sxg/tW5PELrF0QsLBg/B8V0EEEFnbBVG5xufNc9aKLS6Cxkl2fSPBNXkasxy4Grkk0UCLI78nAGd6wOyE75wPNQmukt42ZiAoBJJ2AFcpcfXHT4ZWSOGScD+YbD+tPGazuOxjusEL6g3/pRhLgZ7jvXBp/aBboqKemswRtQYMAT8E1If2iW+d+nShfHqj/im8KOzt9QfV5NSVMJkHfwK4lf7RLIAlemzgnkiUf8URP7RbRmIPT7g52z6go6Uyusni1jAyhAAODz81lm62V8pByNOjnsearOk9fg6x6voRyRtENRVx2pl30a5Djf96OuNR1EZHo6tQ2PatNMgJHalOnTPJ0mJmGDliM9xnY1KRiO4K96xv43gpnRdhsaiHjfbPaq+cOoUx74Hc1KJ9ThhkZG9MkQVyuufIz7dq2IwBqkZfOKPIVUvkeDSbzYx7QSTsD/AL0hMXcMZJAZvGBipJeQHGrUmeCw2pK66h06GHcTzyctlgij4GN6qW6vC0z6cxJwFY5H9aeo10u+j3DUp4JrFGO2BSNjP6jhFY+myalUnOkjkVapbtIO+kVfFCcqs4KoNwN6QhtiZjqICrzvVvdzpawGGNQXI5PNUsUrTyFABpX8xp4r4txdRxJtsw2BoMtw0xySR+lBAITOFCLuc/71WXP1L0i1kMct4hdRjCZbFWCVbK7DG455o2hGAd1Jx81z6fV/RRgfiTnHJQ0Zvqzo+kFbon/1PNY61auMLwuc5ogLR7KSoPODVHH9U9IYgG7GrxpNW6TJJGGjOoMMg02WLdLX/qSQuqngZ+9IfTXVJOj9c/EbiGb+Dcr/AJc7H9DVhdXK2sTAH3Ed6qxbmJ2adNOvB32yPIrpxnjNuPaY4GeNWGcEZGKyvMoPrHq9pAlvFODHGNKkjfArK1jJ8kBGU/lPeqq7cRoTnfgCgzdVexiKsursu3FViztNcly2WByPiuUjrpyCzEn8WQg+PirS9VI7UqmxA3qthuiQMacgb7U1f3ERs9bnDsMYJ5NOJS9PiNxfKXyRCwYD5roYs7D+bv8AFKdKslS3TBf1G5IO1WOIbVSWYMy8g1aza4T6+6kYUj6XGTqb+JLjx2FcAN2IA0/Nei9T6RF1O/mvZstJKc/YDgUl/wBqROrMg+1dOPjGVw+cNjmt8c7jwK6mX6Rl1NpJAoB+l5kyudxzmt6utc7sBjgd6ZtLd5pFVQcsQoq3P09IqFmIA+auehdLVXGB7gvt75NW4pPVvYWX/TVg/Dga/SwxA5J8000MjMgafUzMARin7eGSKW1EsCemqgSPr3z9qPJMIme+WKMxxN6UW+QW7muPLk6RZC7jghihSAqiIFAzvttW7d0vFeNBpkJxljVIvWr1pPVJhZl4ymR9qtLG9gvTqZEguse5ANj81yuxuZRXs3QjVrJH7UIgrIUxjuARtTlneSQg2904PdCN8j5opNvKwwP68VbqzFdNGZUCrqVlHI71UzJNPOlvEMSSkJqI/L5OK6No48nSWyKUkwlyswXEiHxWuOaPzxWH6Nspctc315Ie6wlYwP6E1W330f0mPKWnUbv1s50PpkA/XbFXt/1JxCIYVKM35mz2qttcLg438nmulscuPG7tP9M6fHawKNRdgPzGnppikZ0LjHcUrDL7wcfG1Fvbq1ityXk92PavcmsWeukUd5JNPOqRbyNyfFWtvapBGIwFOOTjk1X2c8a65Z3CM52BHApfrvUnFg8NgxE7jAb/AAjuac/gct9YfUbyXD9Os5MRLtI68N8VxnY8A10cP01PKfzE6u5pkfR7qDrcFRXaeRzsctDGXI2ziri06Nc3K5RNK92O2K6K26FDaIuF1HvkVbwwhIxGoG5q1qRVWXQobWFfYsk3+Jhya6SHFpahcadPitwWxjUs2nI4qr6lfgAxIdRz2rnbrUn4lLN+LuCWJAGwpuObREYrlDNbnbGd1+xoViizR4P5+21FkntovZJIYy22TxTufF1EWGzVQEulCjjVz+tZUhZWeN7gA+Nqynt/g6xTXzsyNk5xxS8MzngnTjB+9M37LHC3uGtmG2aQSRAilR7j/SsA4rrGWCkluRntUoy1zOhcnnj4pT1cgkHBqy6UNUhJGoYwCaqo6OxX04X3A0Jnc0hf3KSao0OAPPejtP6JaIn2MPdv2quaIknG4JyprHGXWgXbCc53o0KadIxvjjOK2tuAQ78DfAFHxhiwwT5Pau0gsaHtUqSc/NCm3yAq/tRCSD2OfmondcODntik/ipuIhICjEKcdzirDoloscjSlfbGdK798Us9t6s4UsVwNz3q9sYWis9LHG2ckbms2+MSDS3wXEKRK0zMEXK5zkVCWzc2Qtc8HIX581Wv1FbXqccwXJiOceadk+obOUgMjoT8cVysdIQjgKMEOxU8GnbeEy3VuYfzq+HxxpxvUF6layZ0uGGe9MQXkKH+HIqH/Kd6r2s9UyH7swq8ZOoSAhVAG361NdYbUqkKPNQtZIpLhXnbWsfAP81ZdSenO0iyLpOcAcVmTI3sMpIzM+MccUlO6aWAb3HatC50YJkHGCc7UGdosfnTbxTIC9yVaNCDk8HHekzeRQP+UtjsDih3d2sMZjUjUT+1V2rfJ3rfxinJup3EntiUQKe43NEs7drpwzszgd23zVfHG7ShF5OwzXSQqtlbAHbAzn5o0lpI1sg0jkO52C42pIQPIS53JP7CjyA3MzSPnH8oNG1YIAHwK3xBaJRCzN+gogbOc4x333obAbn9MVtSFi4Gc1pBS5Mu4IH2pq2QRxieVDuMpmlokkuJDoB+5o8xS3XVK2tsYHx9qxam5rzUCsa6pG7eBVHFYXK3JadTknkDtTyNIknrDAOd/tTLX+Qcr3zVhjXplCChIwN8bUSysous9Wsen+mXE0wMvkIN2NJzXrBNKhiXOkADeu9+iuhN0m1kv7kj8ZcLpVSN41/+0yK3C5+kfp1SR/09jjvqP/NZXVi2VhkuMnmspxz7PAWkecESHJz4rSAqNPGO5FSUfzYI2qSkk9gB5NWJmkYO9dJ09Bb2iEIc4/c1zkamW5ROATjFdMdOCgZgigCs8jK2BgFzktzxTcK+9GL+3TvmgRnIwvijv09Xh9VtQf8AlBOBRLI03MAqkxgsB8UqshycgAf6UeO3YgASgAcjUd6g8Uaz5/MVOADxTKNCwrnnjg96iI5F3IbTmjgBgTnGeABxRDpUaxo140/l3NOoK0tsSyStjVzg+Pis6jd+nEWjIAHB80ZnyoO4PGwqn6vMuFiTGR3O1Z+r4rnuCxLMdT+TUA5YZYn4rQTUMbc+KZjhLnAA35FaniLb5IBIA/eixkjueNqaTp7lj7lB8Vs2yhdskDxxRacgRvZ0XAk0kcYrPx1yqYFxLq/8zWmtQAXYmhEgHfIz84oxbgguJNGTI7EjG5zQmaQnIJx2yd62PeunI2qQKoMYyRTBsgYVmJPC9h5oqrIqkjP7UVCp4IB+KZt1M0oxkqv5qlLDnSbX0x68uC5Ht+1Ozy4TDkE9h8UW2WRsaQAAMCtG2Ky6l0se++aDpYs4jyse+NgO9BKSyKDo0t809oZwBoOAMHtQyNA0sCd+/anf4NwqLPO8kmn7DNSS2QPgEsO+rajgYY7/AKVpjp8/vVtG6h6wgyVOcDtVTPcTTzKyhTpOQMUa/l39NHUr3K0g5KrpXJJ5okxqNSSuxY8e6p59GMySHCqO4o1tCW9wGSOBium+numm56gPURTCqEnI71vQH9K/Trzzx9UvQQqnVChH9TXfqSDkk81GKNU220jxRMYGT3oY+p6x8VlArKtDwjQCpA271BjgkA7AdhT6xoCeT96GIEJJGQc71a010uHXOZACdI/rXSW1rLI2dD4x9qsvpKCztbWSSeAtI2GRex7b10n4+3MUTPZRCLJU6GIK/r37Vm1pz8HRb5gJkKxoP8Tb5+1NXFiY4zLc3g1NtoCkn/5VxLdxhz6BKod1BbJzXL9amupIpFtriM3K4bVIQdOe4HfiiM/UPRQSMFdhj4oi2sEhxGZGfJFcnPZdZe6Bl6xeTSagyjGlMfbNdtFfW9hbapiqEDByNyfjvT8WYJb9HiUDWJSx8kYop6QjnCH/ANmYAUzazTXseLYB1wD7QKagttN9Hb3cU7I6ttEdwRxtRshmqh+lW0scgimhkeIe4KSd/viuPntVe4cEMMnYV1v1DeT2afh/w34QNkKpXDEeSe9cyvpYBUk4rM5NYglrHHuQBU1iXVpReedqlrHJG3ipLeRR59m/mm8r+GcGLb6j+XGBgVMwhSFH5VG4BpZ78McthQP82KieoxKNJnjU841b1m7Wsk+GHT08ELnfIB4qrvfUe4JkiIye3emH6ijoQsmfnNCFyJSSqljjbAzWuOjlIU0HJwMeMmiBDt2NbWCeQZW2mYZ/liamIOl3jbi1nA8lCMfuK2x8BCe4AAljxV9aWkUUQEkyR53Os4NLWfT7uC4EjWE8rDtwKjP0rqc07yPY3BJPGANqh46OOM+nhZQEI2xvmqa56/Y2s728SX17OmxFvH7R/wCxp6MdR9EKOmPGqrhQXH+vaq49F6zKxZII1XPBmAxRxm/VvEG3v5ryT1J1mtolP92XBz96LcdYiJ0wqWC8nO1MN0bqUkJiCW0SHHvaXJ/oKCv0peKPdcWw+zE/7VqcReXH+kW6pIWwsaj5yalJdS/huP4jbYqyi+nZLZtZuIXYeQSBQLjpjmRpGnBJ8LVl0zlxU6xvsWJ+QKGVctlRgeTVqLPR/Pkfapw9N/ETBQWzxsKspnPi101XnIhRcFe9ehdJsRbW67DWRSXRehxWMWpgS3+YVcplT4p+M26YAD7eBU9IwOdqhGRr9uxqZOFzvmsiFzgHFZRM/wCT+lZT4w8y/wC1r8Lktb5+JNqwfTF6Uw72oPn1D/xXWkaY9QznGM0AMQaWe9hSCyuoUCr+DUKAqkux/wBBUzBe/hwv4i1UrIX2RiDkeP0qwQE7DztUJQUTHcGrrD3pMxXATHqRZA3wp/pvQz0/1MF3TCjtHx/Wn9IZAc4PmojTpbfk+Ksg78iaWCoPZKVYkbiP/wC0pcfT1vdXDXNxeXDEn8gVQo/3q1c5K4Jwu/Na1bfrmrIe9/qFnbR2FpJFbAxmTmQABh9q3NCLmAxS3F05OzSCTS7f+w3qW43I2qYYDfSNNGQd+X9K3XT7O8hjimSaSKIYXXKSw/XmhDofSYs+naN+szn/AHqy0gDGNj2oS874xjtVkXfl/Sv/AEzp381hE+Bj3Fj/AL1Jek9OUER9PtgAeNOf9aNnB/WiL7Tr5z2FI7UIWllGSEsrRQOSIVrDFbqxxa23wfSX/iiI2CQSQPFRJ92e1Q2ikIsYKpGP/FAK0JXwRj2k7VI49POML2FQDKQSQM8ir4dSEjlfzHK9s1FpH7sxJ+aiNhkc1IMBnv4qUv8AUFYhvzGsckjbP6msAKtjOM1ORVVT7s9qgGDjbG1SjOF74zQ8ZbYbY5osYJGB4qMxJsAaBn4oYBBxtjzR1hlcjGQO9NRdMdyD28VTw5/FW2WGABt4pdrG4uG0xxk55yK6yPp0cS5IB+1GKLH7VGnG9JnFzVn9MKSGuZTjwoq8tbC0skxBCucbseaPxvjFbCkdqztM8SiTPbFY0WCcH7VkQ9+M0UDGd80yNQup0nJ2x4qRkTGMd6nLGAMjaljhZhHjOU158YIGKyoPq+DWUPJG1ZRkL//Z" /></blockquote> 8 Bolt C80E-N head, picture. -- Royce Peterson, 03/29/2002
Late service replacement for 427 Low Riser. This one has a 1969 casting date.

Royce Peterson

[Image edited for size by Admin.]
Collapse <a href=../ForumFE/reply.aspx?ID=12353&Reply=12351><img src=../images/reply.png width=30 height=10></a>&nbsp;<b>That's a strange one.</b>&nbsp;-- <font color=#0000ff>Dave Shoe, <i>03/29/2002</i></font><br /><blockquote>Thanks for the pic.<br><br>What kind of info or history do you have on this head.  Did you hear something about it being a 427LR replacement head?<br><br>Shoe. </blockquote> That's a strange one. -- Dave Shoe, 03/29/2002
Thanks for the pic.

What kind of info or history do you have on this head. Did you hear something about it being a 427LR replacement head?

Shoe.
 RE: That's a strange one. -- Royce Peterson, 03/29/2002
An old racer sold it to me, he was using a pair on a 427 in a 1968 Mustang fastback. Said he ordered a pair of 427 Low Riser heads and these showed up. Valves are 2.09 / 1.66 factory CJ valves.

I also have a C8AE-J with the same characteristics but no history. The -J head has a August 1967 date code.

Royce Peterson

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