Skip Navigation Links.
 |  any ideas on a 1/4mile time or hp guess on this CJ -- mike allen, 03/10/2002
i have a 69 mach 1 with a 428 cobra jet 4spd and 3:90 posi . it has a PI intake, stock CJ exhaust manifolds 2.5 inch exhaust, it has a 272 H10 energizer from crane cams and the stock CJ heads what do u guys think it can do?
|
|  | more on that cam please! -- James, 03/10/2002
I will venture a guess on your 1320 times if you will give me more than the advertised stuff they put on the cam box. You see, they can put all kinds of numbers for advertising on the box. The real info is duration @ .050 and lift. That information is on a card/paperwork that came with the cam. I would like to know what kind of ignition the car has. Is it the old point system? Dual point? I would also like to know what kind of tire and size. Originaly your car would run 14.00 bone stock I have been told by an original owner from way back. Hope this gives you something to go on. |
| | RE: any ideas on a 1/4mile time or hp guess on thi -- Mike McQuesten, 03/10/2002
James is right in that it would be nice to have more specs on the Crane cam but based on the basics, he's right also in that you should run at least 14.0.
The PI will help with it's lighter weight but that's it. The stock CJ was similar except it was iron. Best iron intake ever made for an FE.
Driver skill has a lot to do with ETs. Especially with a 4 speed. Tires/traction are also a major factor. Tune condition and settings are extremely important.
So, I can tell you that I personally drove a '69 Fairlane Cobra SCJ, 3.91s, C-6, Thermactor pump removed, BF22 Autolite plugs, G70 X 14 Goodyear Polyglas GT tires, completely stock exhaust system all the way out the stock chrome tips that came in the trunk:
13.7 et/101 mph.
This was with the Cobra being literally new in the summer o-'69. Very consistent. Just found that leaving the column shift selector in -D-, ease it out of the hole a few feet and stab the pedal and hold on. Obviously very little skill required. |
| | RE: any ideas on a 1/4mile time or hp guess on this CJ -- Norm F., 03/10/2002
My 68 CJ seems to be a similar combo but uses the crane 294 Fireball Solid lifter cam w/Tri -Y headers and runs 13.5 at 104 MPH ,street tires and 2 1/4 exhaust . Your combo should be similar . Good luck. |
| |  | My car had problems and still ran.... -- James, 03/10/2002
I ran a 13:76 @ 102 with fuel fouled plugs, a sick trans and u-joints going. I have a c6 with 3:50 gears and a .514 lift, 224 duration cam on a stock torque converter. I was reluctant to share this since our cars are set up so different. I thought that it might not be a good comparison but I am usually interested in what others are running and thought that you might be interested so there you go. |
|  | RE: any ideas on a 1/4mile time or hp guess on this CJ -- Derek, 03/12/2002
Mike, you've received some pretty good input here so far. Don't buy into the 'factory sales literature', or the often quoted Hot Rod magazine test on the original '68 CJ Mustangs, that saw it run 13.56@108...that was NOT the kind of car you could buy off the showroom floor!!
My personal experience, with a similar '69 Cobra Fairlane to what one of the other respondents had (SCJ/C-6/3.50 open/stock exhaust), was that it hit a best ever 13.92 @ 102.34
In your case, you've got a little lighter car, a little better intake (Ford only credited it with 6-8 hp over the cast iron one), but the cam is really marginal, and the exhausts are too restrictive. Sorry, but that is just a cheaper 'generic' single-pattern cam that's not optimized for the FE cylinder heads or induction/exhaust setups.
If you check the Crane or Lunati catalogues, you will find that their 'factory replacement' cam for a 390GT/428CJ has about 228I/234E duration @ .050" lifter rise, and .481"/.490" lift. The one you have gives up the benefit of the added exhaust duration, in favor of some more lift. Unfortunately, the net effect is very little change in the power output overall.
Assuming you've still got the 735cfm Holley on top of that 'H' manifold, that's good enough to run 9 second quarters on a Super Stocker, so it should be good for almost anything you'd want to do with it. Jetting will run around 70-72 front and 85-86 rear. This manifold does not have the equalized fuel distribution of the 'Sidewinder' 427 manifold, so you might have to bias the jetting to the low side of the dual-plane design.
You ARE going to need more cam timing, and I'd suggest looking at some of Crower's listings. I can't remember the grind number, but they have a cam around 237I/247E duration @ .050", with around .550"/.580" lift. Upgrade your valve springs to something in the 320-340 lbs. range
They advertise this cam as having "..violent mid-range acceleration and torque", which is what you want. This will probably add in the neighbourhood of 50+hp to your motor. It will kill off a little torque at the engine speeds you likely leave the starting line at (which can actually be a good thing!), but will more than make up for it later, pulling hard right to 6,500rpm, which is as far as you really want to go anyway.
Get some headers on the car to get rid of all that extra airflow through the motor! The Hooker 'standard' headers with the one pipe that slips together work well, and have decent ground clearance.
You don't indicate if you're going to run with street tires or slicks, and that can impact other components. If you'd like your car to be able to get into the 12's almost like you'd drive it on the street, consider an aluminum flywheel to take out some of the stored rotational energy during the launch, in favor of allowing the engine to wind-up quicker as it gets going. With 9" slicks, the stock 35 lbs iron flywheel weight will do fine with that 2.32 1st gear and the 3.91's.
It wouldn't be unrealistic to expect 12.7-12.5 ET's, at about 104-105mph (Today's NHRA Stock Eliminator CJ Mustangs are going mid-to-high 10's at over 126mph!)
Good luck with your car. Keep it in one piece...they go up in value daily! |
| | | Derek, what do you think of the Lunati replacement -- James, 03/12/2002
I stopped myself from buying Lunati's stock 428 replacement cam that you mentioned. I chose the 218 duration @ .050 with .494 lift from Comp. Cams. I am curious about if the cam I chose will give it something or actually be slower than the stocker. I would like some opinions. |
| | | | RE: Derek, what do you think of the Lunati replacement -- Norm F., 03/12/2002
Well Mike back to your original question...... as others have suggested you need a little more cam to get into the 12s . Something around 232Deg on the intake and maybe a little more on the exhaust side with an LSA of 110 to 112 , lift is not as critical , .515 to .550 should do it. If you go to a solid cam then pick something around 235 to 240 Deg with the same or a little more lift.Your car probably weighs around 3700 lbs with you in it . You will need 10 to 10.5 to 1 compression , headers and a good exhaust 2.5 or 3 in dia. A stock CJ or PI type intake with a carb around 750 cfm will do it with 3.89-1 to 4.30-1 gears , shift point 6000-6200RPM.
Note my 68 1/2 GT runs 13.5 and I shift at 5500RPM as I have a milder cam with street tires and a lousy 60 foot time so getting you into the 12s with the right comb is doable and won't ruin the drivability of your car. |
| | | | | RE: Derek, what do you think of the Lunati replacement -- Eric, 03/13/2002
I hate to beat on this horse but does anyone know the actual specs of the factory stock 428cj cam.?
My goal is to add about 20-30 hp without a heavy lope.
I purchased a Lunati Grind #H220-230 (duration @ .050), lift at valve .536 IN .563, Rocker Ratio 1.73, Valve Adjust. 0.0, Lobe Sep. 110
Did I screw-up? Again, I want the sound of a mild cam and nothing that will give me idle probs or add to my occasional over-heating whoes. Try to keep it simple, I'm a rookie !
Thanks for any help !
Eric |
| | | | | | RE: Derek, what do you think of the Lunati replacement -- Derek, 03/13/2002
Right from Lunati's website, here are their specs for a stock 428CJ cam:
Cam Only Number - 10503
Duration @ .050 - 224° (Int) / 232° (Exh)
Advertised Duration - 304° (Int) / 324° (Exh)
Gross Valve Lift - .481"/.490"
Lobe Separation - 114°
The cam you chose provides about the same duration, a good bit more lift, and a tighter C/L. The net effect will be better breathability up through the mid range, but only a modest increase at peak (<6000RPM according to Lunati). I doubt you'll get all of that 25-30HP out of it, but it is a good choice for a street cam, with the idle characteristics you were looking for. |
| | | | | | | RE: Derek, what do you think of the Lunati replacement -- Eric, 03/13/2002
Thanks Derek, that's a relief !
I bumped the torque converter up to a TCI Breakaway with 1000 RPM increase over stock and still have the stock 3.25 gears. Hopefully the cam w/ these combinations will work out.
Thanks again,
Eric |
| | | | | | RE: Derek, what do you think of the Lunati replacement -- Norm F., 03/13/2002
Eric
The CJ specs out about 224 I , 230 E @050 114 LSA 46 Deg of overlap , (the Lunati CJ replacment cam is probably right on) . The cam you have might be 10-15 HP better than this , hard to tell , dependent on your combination of parts. Its on a 110 LSA and probably on a 106 deg Intake CL which is 4 degrees advanced . If you have sufficient rear end gear ratio and a free flowing exhaust you might try retarding it 2 degrees (108 deg CL) . I think its not a bad pick and should be as good or a little better than the CJ cam. If you want to tinker with cam selection pick up a copy of Dyno 2000 . Its not too bad a tool to compare various combinations.
About every 10 degrees duration up or down will shift the power range about 500-800 RPM , retarding or advancing the cam will have a similar effect. |
| | | | RE: Derek, what do you think of the Lunati replacement -- Derek, 03/13/2002
James, since we're talking about the Lunati version, which is not necessarily 'exactly' the same as the stock Ford C6AZ-B, I'd have to say that your Comp Cams unit definitely gives something up to it.
If you check their listings for other engines (even different brands), you'll find that this same grind appears over and over, with just the lift varying due to rocker arm ratio. These are 'generic' cams, with little real development work for each engine.
Again, although there have been signicant improvements in camshaft design over the last three decades, it can still be said that NOBODY knew more about their motors than the factory.
On the 427, which was designed to run within a (relatively) narrow RPM range, Ford gave it lots of duration and lift (for its day), and a single-pattern design.
However, on the 390GT (which is where the 428CJ cam originates from), which was most often coupled to an automatic transmission and 'street' gears, they went with a dual-pattern design, to acknowledge the limitations of the factory heads and exhaust systems of the day, and make it more tractable on the street.
You don't have all that much duration in your Comp cam, but you do have the single-pattern design. With the Lunati profile at 224°/232° @ .050", and .481"/.490" lift, you're giving up 6°-14° duration, and gaining almost nothing in net lift. |
| | | | | does a few degrees of duration make a big diff. -- mike allen, 03/13/2002
just like it says would 5 degrees of duration make a big differance in performance. I was trying to get an idea of how much duration plays into performance
|
| | | | | | RE: does a few degrees of duration make a big diff. -- Norm F., 03/13/2002
Every 10 degrees of duration shifts the power range up or down about 500RPM , lift is not as critical depending on the flow characteristics of the heads and the exhaust and intake systems . Depending on what you are trying to gain , at 6000 RPM given you have a good intake and exhaust the heads on an FE will have the biggest impact on performance. Getting the head flow right could mean 30-40 HP . Cams within 10 degrees duration of each other shift the power range around but are probably within 10-15 HP of each other.Hope that helps. |
| | | | | | | What if I were to advance the CJ cam 2 deg. -- James, 03/13/2002
If a person were to install the original CJ cam 2 degrees advanced, wouldn't that shift the power band of that cam slightly and help the drivability of the car plus make a few more horses? |
| | | | | | | | RE: What if I were to advance the CJ cam 2 deg. -- Norm F., 03/13/2002
If you install the cam "straight up" it already has 4 degrees of advance built in . Advancing it another 2 degrees builds cylinder pressure earlier on the low end and would shift the power range down about 200 RPM (bottom end will be better). But the risk is , if you have greater than 10-1 compression it may ping a little and you may need to back off your spark advance.
Before you go and do this you need to get everything else dialed in , jetting , spark advance , exhaust etc. get some times , track ,g-tech meter etc then you tinker otherwise you don't know what work and what does not ? |
| Looking at mid 60s Cabover truck w/332 -- doug bolden, 03/10/2002
i believe.My question concerns the trans. its an allison 5 speed auto. Has any one some knolage of this unit.
Parts available? Quality ? doug |
|  | RE: Looking at mid 60s Cabover truck w/332 -- Mike McQuesten, 03/10/2002
Quality? From my personal experience driving a Budwieser delivery truck for five years with a Hesse Box on a Ford Louisville w/361 & Allison 5 speed automatic: Excellent! Never a problem with engine or transmission. And these rigs take a lot of abuse! Unlike the Internationals or Whites I had to drive the other five years the Louisville's were the best of the distributorship's fleet.
Parts should be easily available. |
| | Beware of trucks with 332's that are not FE's... -- kevin, 03/13/2002
you better investigate this further, as people are not often aware of this. |
| | RE: What do you see wrong with this ebay auction? -- Tom P, 03/10/2002
first its obvious its no 429 ...it doesn't even appear to be a 428... maybe a 390 judging from the wider space between the bores , the piston tops, the small bolt rods |
| 427 question -- John, 03/08/2002
I have located an NOS flywheel with the casting number C5AE-E. 184 teeth. My ford data indicates that this is a 427 flywheel. Can anyone help with this? thanks...and great forum! John |
| | Yes - for '65 cars, bef. 3-1-65. Welcome to the group. :-) [n/m] -- Mr F, 03/09/2002
n/m |
| | | RE: Yes - for '65 cars, bef. 3-1-65. Welcome to the group. :-) [n/m] -- John, 03/09/2002
Thanks. You assisted me on the VMF before on a NOS export brace. thank you...John |
| | | | Wait a minute!.... -- kevin, 03/09/2002
All the early ones I have are 153 tooth and use the old style starter. In mid 65 Ford switched to the newer 184 tooth and appropriate starter, and bellhousing. Is there some one off one I have no knowledge of, or do you mean after 3-1-65? |
| | | | | Chill, dude. After 3-1-65, they used a 'C6-' part. :-) [n/m] -- Mr F, 03/09/2002
n/m |
| Oil Drip Trays -- John, 03/08/2002
I have after-market rocker shaft stands and they won't fit with the drip trays as they are square vs rounded. I havn't thought about it much yet, but I would like to modify the drip trays (not file off the corners of the stands) to make them fit. Has anybody got any ideas? I think if I just elongate the drip tray holes, they will move too close and come in contact with the springs. If I try to bend the drip trays, I will have to drill relief holes in the drip trays which will sacrifice their purpose. And through not using drip trays before, I know they are a good idea to use. Any ideas? |
| | File the corners of the stands. -- Dave Shoe, 03/08/2002
THe corners stick out in the middle of nowhere and add no strength.
By all means, file the corners.
Not also that not all stampings are identical. Some will fit your engine, some won't. As the years passed, many slight variations of these drip trays were made. They all did the same thing.
HOWEVER, it should be recognized that the drip trays on all 1958-66 FE's had three drainback fingers which really do help return some oil to the crankcase from the heads. Since the drainback hole in the FE head is rather restrictive, it's nice to get all the drainback you can. 1967-78 drip trays (these don't have the drain-back fingers) are a simpler, cheaper stamping which are just perfect for meeting price/production targets for grocery-getters.
Again, your square stands WILL fit some drip tray stampings (both early and late types), but not all. File the corners as needed. Don't get caught up in the "gotta keep 'em looking like new" syndrom. Focus on getting your motor to kick some ass.
JMO,
Shoe. |
| | This is for the Super Cobra Jet only. -- James, 03/08/2002
The front is zero, or neutral, on the regular CJ but the Super CJ had this balancer and a special crank shaft. |
| | | RE: This is for the Super Cobra Jet only. -- John, 03/08/2002
I have a spare 428 crank...an IUB..do I need this item? Even if I do, won't machine shop balancing with heavy metal make up for the lack of it? |
| | | | RE: This is for the Super Cobra Jet only /No -- Ray, 03/08/2002
That little balance hub is used for SCJ engines with lemans rods and 1UA crank. The rods are about 50 to70 grams heaver than a standard 3/8 or 13/32 rod . But you could use 1UA crank with regular 428 rods and rebalanced and should be harder running engine than SCJ if everything else is equal. Thats because rotating and recipocating mass is about 400 grams less than lemans rod motor. Ray |
| | | | | RE: This is for the Super Cobra Jet only /No -- John, 03/09/2002
Thanks Ray. Your info matches up with what I found out except I was under the impression that the counterweight was cast into the balancer vs a seperate unit. I guess I learn something new about these engines all the time. |
| | | | | | Obviously the bidders are not aware... -- kevin, 03/09/2002
that new ones are available for 80 bucks (repro). This one has two holes for balancing out. Mine have all had only one. Epoxy prevented dirt from accumulating in hole on dirt track, changing balance. Same thing goes for flywheel lightening/balance holes. Even with inspection covers, it can get everywhere. |
| | | | | | | Repop? -- Ed Foral, 03/10/2002
Who is manufacturing/selling these new?
Thanks
Ed |
| | | RE: This is for the Super Cobra Jet only. -- Derek, 03/10/2002
The 428 SCJ motors not only used the 'LeMans' rods from the 427MR motor (with a modified head on the cap screws), but also used the heavier 692 or 712 gram pistons, and a much thicker, heavier wrist pin.
The center counterweight on the SCJ crankshafts were done away with, in favor of moving it out to the front of the block, behind the dampener (this was not the smartest idea, as it contributes to crank 'whip' out there ahead of the #1 bearing, whereas the passenger and CJ motors had it nicely supported by the #3 thrust main).
Many Super Stock racers eliminate the 'cookie cutter', and internally balance the motor via Mallory metal in the flywheel and other crankshaft counterweights. |
| Marti report's 2 cobra's and a Gt 428CJ -- Allen, 03/08/2002
First car 69 Cobra Q code Black Bucket seats, 4spd, Candy Apple red Sports roof .
2,519 with this Paint code (T)
1,135 With these paint and trim codes (CA)
1,322 with 428cj non ram air and 4spd (Q) (6)
Second car 69 Cobra Q code Black vinyl/cloth bench, C6 auto, Wimbledon white Formal roof.
239 with this paint code (M)
67 with this paint and trim code.(1A)
667 with 428cj non ram air and c6 cruise-o-matic (Q) (U)
Third car 69 Torino GT R code Ivy gold vinyl bench, 4spd, Lime gold paint Sports roof.
5,510 with this paint code (I)
2,279 with these paint and trim codes.(6G)
582 with 428cj ram air and 4spd (R) (6)
|
| 427 record that will never be broken -- David Thayer, 03/08/2002
1967 Le Mans,, AJ Foyt & Dan Gurney. 388 laps, 5223KM in 24 hrs. Still stands today!! |
| | RE: Sorry, got my facts wrong -- David Thayer, 03/08/2002
It was beat, 1971, 1988, & 1989. Still in the top 5 after 35 years, not bad for an old "station wagon motor" |
| I've got some 427 blueprints for sale - cheap. -- Dave Shoe, 03/08/2002
As mentioned before, I just picked up a set of FE 427 blueprints off ebay for a pittance.
There are 12 sheets of paper to this set, each sheet measures 18" X 24" (slightly larger than size C, so I couldn't copy any tonite).
The Ford master printset appears to be six sheets of size F paper at full scale. These (I'm guessing) were shrunk to half-scale (size D) for general distribution inside Ford, and each sheet was apparently split in half so it could be recorded to microfiche for wider distribution.
The 12 sheets of these prints are labeled "Frame 1" thru "Frame 12", probably for the microfiche department (remember these are just hairbrained theories of mine - I'm just trying to figure out what the hell I just bought). Frame 1 and 2 appear to represent the first sheet of the blueprints, 3 and 4 the next, and there is some overlap between the pairs, so fading at the edge of one sheet is sometimes easy to read on the neighbor sheet.
Fading is an issue, but optical blooming is also present, making the fattened characters hard to distinguish in some cases. Overall, the prints are still great.
At the time of this writing, I see the price of a set going for $75.00 tops, postpaid. This number will drop if a few extra folk hop on.
Check out the fordfe.com posts for blueprint details:
Cam bearing revelation:
http://www.network54.com/Hide/Forum/message?forumid=74182&messageid=1015555058
New rib theory:
http://www.network54.com/Hide/Forum/message?forumid=74182&messageid=1015556606
Blueprint project status:
http://www.network54.com/Hide/Forum/message?forumid=74182&messageid=1015558266
I hope to start mailing these on Saturday.
Shoe.
|
| | How do we get em? -- P, 03/08/2002
Are you sending them C.O.D. ? Do we send money, if so, where? (etc.)
thanks, P |
| | | I haven't thought that far ahead yet. -- Dave Shoe, 03/08/2002
Well, actually I have, but I haven't yet had a chance to put it into text.
I picked-up the size-I (eye) paper this morning (18" X 24") and will run a batch of copies tonite. I'll email everyone on the list later tonite.
Shoe. |
| | | | RE: I haven't thought that far ahead yet. -- BOB HOPKINS, 03/08/2002
DAVE;
Your are not going to forgit the guy that brought the plans to your attention are you when your making up the lists of who gits one?? |
| | | | | Who would that be? -- Dave Shoe, 03/08/2002
Just kidding.
You're now on the list.
Shoe. |
| | | | | | RE: Who would that be? -- BOB HOPKINS, 03/08/2002
OR maybe the top of your S*&#@ list depending on the amount of headakes this creates?? |
| | | | | | | RE: Who would that be? -- Davy Gurley, 03/08/2002
Shoe, count me in. E-mail me for pricing and mailing info |
| | | | | | | Bob H, I can't get your email address to work. -- Dave Shoe, 03/11/2002
Bob,
I converted the comma to a period, but I still can't get your email address to work.
Could you email be so I can find out your correct email address.
Shoe.
shoe@bitstream.net |
| | | | | | | | OK, I fixed Bob's 'mailto' in all his posts. [n/m] -- Mr F, 03/14/2002
n/m |
| | | | | | | | | I do thank you -- Bob H., 03/14/2002
ussins old F*#@* needs all puter helps weens gits!! |
| 427 cyl jacket draft is 1/4 deg above parting line -- Dave Shoe, 03/07/2002
and 1 degree below parting line.
The prints arrived this morning.
I'll put some time into them after work.
Shoe. |
| | Great news! Now I can sleep tonight. -- Alan Casida, 03/07/2002
Bfd! |
| | | Don't smear someone because he doesn't "get it". -- Mr F, 03/08/2002
|
Alan's position is understandable. This kind of
stuff has value only to a select few. It looks very odd
to outsiders, when they see us carrying on over nothing more than a pile
of old photocopies. After all, collectors don't refer to paper
goods as ephemera* for nothing.
And, frankly - I like it
that way. For the past couple decades, I've bought tons of stuff from
owners who thought it was worthless....or very nearly so. Some of them
thought it so peculiar for me to buy their old "junk" that they would not
have been surprised had I a grown a third eyeball, right on the spot.
;-)
Mr F
*New Latin, from Greek ephEmera, neuter
plural of ephEmeros
Date: 1751
1 : something of
no lasting significance -- usually used in plural
2 ephemera
plural : collectibles (as posters, broadsides, and tickets) not
intended to have lasting
value | |
| | | | RE: Don't smear someone because he doesn't "get it". -- Alan Casida, 03/08/2002
I used to "get it", but I guess I got over it. I used to collect any and everything FE related I could get my hands on. But as I got older I noticed all this stuff I "had" to have was just laying around collecting dust, so last year I cashed out my extra FE stuff to concentrate on my current projects. I still have bug though, I recently bought an FE Edelbrock 6 deuce manifold that I have no idea what I will ever use it on.
If I came on too strong I appologise, but no one has answered my original question; What good is it for me to know the cylinder jacket draft angle relationship to parting line of the block! |
| | | | | Its likely of no use to you, whatsoever. :-) [n/m] -- Mr F, 03/08/2002
n/m |
| | | | | We figured you were pulling our leg... -- P, 03/08/2002
...that's why we just flashed the "BS Meter" in stead of giving you a "bitch slapping" (like this!)
http://server27.hypermart.net/rtstabler51/slap.gif
Actually, I can sleep better at night too!! But I'm going to be reading over those prints like the dead sea scrolls. Very interesting tidbit from the horsepower wars.
Regards,
P |
| | | | | RE: Don't smear someone because he doesn't "get it". -- Mario428, 03/10/2002
I am getting a set and I do have a use for them. I race an FE and I own half a machine shop with CNC equipment. I made my own C-4 bellhousing by welding a C-6 housing. I would like to fabricate one from scratch and I need to know where all the holes are.
I would also like to make a few billet front covers and the drawings will give me the info. |
| | RE: That was uncalled for -- R Shannon, 03/07/2002
The information might not be importart or interesting to you, but other might want to know it. |
| | | Full sets of prints will be ready at noon tomorrow -- Dave Shoe, 03/07/2002
I'm gonna be sending out full sets of these prints in tube mailers to anyone who wants them, starting at noon tomorrow.
I'd like to see these things populate the earth like bunny rabbits. I'll probably spend two weeks on this project doing my share. I can think of nothing better than having an overinformed lot of FErs out there building motors.
The cost for a copied set will certainly be below $100.00 out the door (includes paper, tube mailer, and media postage) and probably much less, depending on how many are interested. I will not make any profit from this - I only seek to recoup part of the auction price. This will only be offered for a couple weeks, but I'm sure inexpensive "copies of copies" will be available for a long time to come.
I'll be scanning and posting some of this blueprint info to the forums over the next month for folk who don't see a reason to pony up the bucks for paper, but are still curious about the info.
Since I will be posting some large partial scans, I expect I'll open the post in the FordFE.com forum this evening in order to gather a mailing list of interested persons.
Again: This will not be a "for-profit" venture. This is some sort of "for-info" dealy aimed at FE enthusiasts.
Shoe. |
| | | Please enlighten me. -- Alan Casida, 03/07/2002
Why don't you tell me what having information is going to do for you now that you have it your hot little hands. |
| | | | | RE: Enlightenment comes in many ways -- John, 03/07/2002
Ah....the frustration of the uneducated yields to the power of curiousity. I'd purchase a set of prints from Shoe, if I were you Alan. Could be the start of your enlightenment.
By the way, yellow goo on the inside of the oil filler cap indicates antifreeze in the oil. Bearings aren't happy with antifreeze as a lubricant.
Also, tip for the day...don't eat yellow snow. |
| | | | | | It could also indicate water condensation. -- Dave Shoe, 03/07/2002
If the car is subjected to regular short trips which prevent full vaporization of atmospheric condensation inside the crankcase, you'll also find yellow goo and rust on the dipstick and oil filler cap.
Shoe. |
| | | | | | Gee, if I buy two sets will I be twice as smart! -- Alan Casida, 03/07/2002
Lol! |
| | | | | | | Knowledge is power. -- Royce Peterson, 03/07/2002
If there is one thing I know, it is that evry bit of information yields something I either dd not know or forgot to think about recently. There just might be something useful in the last revision that would be an improvement for my 1964 427. On the other hand there might be something that was not machined properly on my C8AE 6015-G 427. I won't know until a set is in my hot little hands. Shoe, let me know what I owe you and where to send it.
Royce Peterson |
| | | | | | | | RE: Knowledge is power. -- Alan Casida, 03/07/2002
No doubt. I am sure there is some good info on these prints(copies). It just cracks me up that they have been treated like the Holy Grail ever since they came up. I have been building and racing FEs for 28yrs and I have never sat in my garage late at night thinking "man if I only had a set of machining blue prints right now I could figure this out." None of my comments have been meant to be mean spirited, I just felt a little light hearted ribbing was in order! |
| | | | | | | | | in odor is more like it -- mikeb, 03/07/2002
n/m |
| | | | | | | | RE: Knowledge is power. -- Paul G., 03/08/2002
Right on Royce!! Knowledge is Power!!
I am a novice, and a newcomer to FE's I have learned more about FE's in the last month reading this message board, than in my previous 20 years of amateur engine (smallblock) tinkering. I would like a set of the prints for two reasons. First I think they will help me get a good feel for the motor and it's layout. Second, I would like to take the best complete shot and have it framed for my home. My wife is an educator, and the walls in our home are decorated with many original scientific drawings or prints. Some dating into the 1800's. A framed blueprint of the famed Ford 427 would be the coupe de gras for my home. Let me know when I can get them!
Paul Garvin |
| | | | | | | DOG PILE! Alan, he's gonna sell more of them now. -- James, 03/07/2002
It never ceases to amaze me how someone can profit the people they are trying to hurt. Reminds me of that Loui Loui song during the sixties. The religious crowd made such a fuss about it that the song got twice as much publicity than it would have and went platinium in no time. Thanks alan for helping Dave in his indever. |
| | | | | | | you could buy a hundred sets..... -- hawkrod, 03/07/2002
but judging by your attitude to be twice as smart you would only have to learn the next three letters after C! (hint *UCK you). hawkrod and no i don't appreciate your levity. |
| | | | | | | | Alan's got a point. -- Dave Shoe, 03/07/2002
I dropped 600.00+ on these prints (fast shipping, too).
If that don't qualify as nuts, I don't know what does.
Shoe. |
| | | | | | | | | RE: Nuts too! -- Mike McQuesten, 03/10/2002
Okay, I gotta have a set too. Alan's convinced me, knowledge is power. I know Royce cited the cliche but it was Alan's humor that motivated. Think of it, "Alan Casida Motivational Speaker".
Just returned from a trip to Seattle, close to the home ground of the Boss Martians, and have enjoyed catching up reading through this entire thread.
I won't be able to hang 'em framed in the house but they'll be nice reference material on the shop wall.
So please add one more FEnatic who needs a set to the list Dave.
And thanks for doing this. |
| | | | | | | | | | Never Trust a Chick in a Three Window Coupe. -- Dave Shoe, 03/11/2002
The Boss Martians have written the finest FE427 songs of any band. Ever. They'll be visiting Minneapolis in May. You can be sure we'll be burning brats, downing suds, and playing with cars while they're here.
I'll look into running another batch of prints on Friday. I just started a "next batch" list and put you at the top. I believe Evan's name is on a set, too.
Shoe. |
| | | | | | | | | | | RE: Hey Shoe! send me set, Incognitus (Latin) -- Ray, 03/11/2002
Thats incognito you know. |
| | | | | | | | | | | Shoe, Wondering if more are available, -- GaryXL, 11/11/2004
or did I miss out on the party? What's the final cost for a set of prints.
|
| | Just a thought.... -- John, 11/12/2004
I have always believed that when rebuilding old engines, it was far more important to understrand where you could cut corners, not what the exact specs detailed. How much cylinder taper without early demise of spring tension and pronounced oil burning is an example. Of course now that I am rich and famous, .....chuckle......I always rebore. |
| | | Why order prints? -- GaryXL, 11/13/2004
I am interested in getting the prints as I do some fab work and want to build my own adapter to put the 4L80E (GM T/H 400 w/O/D) trans behind an stout FE in a wagon. I could just buy the 700R4 adapters, but prefer to drive myself crazy figuring things out myself.
I already have a stand alone Seq. FI in work based on the Edelbrock Victor style EFI, and have the opportunity to intigrate the trans controller into the main computer using (again) GM electronics. The FI is not that hard once you figure it out (please don't ask me to explain though, I'm not sure I could). I am trying to draw it out as I go and will let everyone know how it works once dialed in (and after I get back from the other side of the world so I can gat back to work on it). |
|