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| What is a good set of rockers for a moderate build -- Justin G, 01/18/2006
I am rebuilding a 66 390 engine to go in my 67 Mustang, I have two secenarios:
1) Performer intake and Cam, stock GT 390 manifolds, minor head work what is a good set of hydraulic lifter rockers for this build?
2) Performer RPM intake, cam and heads with 428 CJ manifolds, what is a good set of hydraulic lifter roller tip rockers for this set up? I was thinking Harland-Sharp.
Thanks |
| | Money to burn. -- Gerry Proctor, 01/19/2006
For option 1, the factory non-adjustable rockers will do fine.
There are a couple of scenarios where you have to go to adjustable rockers. One is obvious -a solid lifter cam. The other really depends on the cam's lift and the type of hydraulic lifter used.
Hydraulic valvetrains have a specification for lifter preload. Factory hydraulic valvetrains are designed to achieve that preload, usually 0.060" of plunger depression, in an assembly line process so there's not a lot of tolerance for custom fitting on the build. Some, but not a lot.
The things that change preload are machining specifications on the block and heads and the cam's measured lift. If you haven't done any machine work on the surfaces of the block or heads, then the preload would be the same as at the factory. If the lift of the cam doesn't significantly alter the base circle dimensions, then the preload can be achieved with stock parts.
But, if you do machine the block or heads or you use a cam with a lot more lift then you'll have to set the lifter preload with pedestal shims, or different pushrod lengths, or with adjustable rockers.
There is some wiggle room on standard hydraulic lifter preload. In other words, you won't kill the engine if you're a little off. I won't argue that there is some impact, but for the most part unless it's significatly off, no one will ever realize it.
So here you are contemplating a full aluminum roller rocker. You kind of skipped over the factory and aftermarket, like Crane, iron adjustable rockers. This is the area where you start getting opinions since that's all there really is. It would be different if you were going to a roller cam. I would say yes, you should or would want to consider going to a roller rocker. But with a flat tappet cam, you have very little to gain by going to a roller rocker setup until you get above the 400lb range on the valve springs. There is no hard and fast rule on this. Will a 500lb spring work well with an iron rocker? Sure. Can you run the roller rockers on a 300lb spring? Sure. Most of all, you want to use complementary parts throughout your rebuild. Using a roller rocker setup with end stands and heavy shafts with beefy pushrods on a relative stock rebuild isn't complementary. Neither is using the stock stuff on a roller-camed engine. It's really a matter of durability. If you're going to beat on the parts, you better use good stuff.
There is another area of consideration when you must use some type of adjustable set up. That is with anti-pumpup lifters. They have a lower preload specification, usually 0.020" and for them to run correctly, you have to be pretty close to that preload.
So, the short answer for option 2, in my opinion, is to look at the Crane iron rockers. If you have the money to burn, then go with the roller rockers. |
| | Whatever you do - don't use Perfprmer RPM Cam! -- Royce P, 01/19/2006
It ia no good for any purpose I know of. Just a poor design, it has too much overlap for any kind of street use and is too mild for a race car. It just sucks.
Its hard to beat Harland Sharp roller rockers if you are talking about just replacement rockers for using valve springs around 300 pounds open pressure.
For say 600 pounds open pressure with a roller cam then maybe a complete Erson roller rocker setup would be better.
Royce |
| | | Thanks guys! -- Justin G, 01/20/2006
this is fun but way to many decisions to make... mostly though I just need to decide on a path and go with it. |
| | | | RE: Thanks guys! -- walt, 01/20/2006
i feel that the crane dual pattern,cams work good street and mild strip,,but seems like all the cam grinders are making split over lap cams for the fe ,on the highside of performance,while you can get many different grinds and options for the bb chevies,moparsi still used a few of my fomco c4ae-b,c8ax-c and d cams and they worked quite well on the hiper side of the perforamance and REALIBILITY , when i deplete my stock, then i'll get the after market cams,but the selection for solid lifter type engine is limited |
| Cant remove torque converter Nuts -- Mike, 01/17/2006
Hello I am removing my engine and am in the final stage of getting it out. However I cant turn the flywheel to remove the torque converter nuts. I think my motor is frozen. Does anyone know of where I can get one of those new crank sockets for a FE 390. This way here I can turn the crank without over tightning my Crank Bolt. Thanks Mike |
| How strong is the standard 428 block? -- CrazyAcadian, 01/16/2006
68 428 block out of T-Bird. The Air cleaner states 428 4V Premium Fuel. I would like to rebuild this motor to fit my 68 mustang convertible. It's going to be use for street with a run down the 1/4 1 or 2 times a year. I will go with the Edelbrock Head/Intake/Cam combo with a 750 Holley. Is the standard 428 block able to handle this setup?
Thanks! |
| | RE: How strong is the standard 428 block? -- Randy Rutledge, 01/16/2006
That combination is well within the limits of that block in my opinion. Your peak power should be well below 6000 rpm so you should rarely if ever have it up that high. The biggest problem I've had is finding a good machine that knows these motors and how to build them. With the correct build, that motor should last you many miles. |
| | | Get a different cam -- Royce P, 01/19/2006
The Edelbrock RPM cam has been tried by several FE ' ers and nobody seems to like it. No vacuum, poor response as a result. Too much overlap. Call Comp, Crane or Isky. Any of them can recommend a better cam.
Royce |
| | | | RE: Get a different cam -- CrazyAcadian, 01/19/2006
Thanks Royce. Ive heard the same for their carbs. Many guys down here have junked them for Holleys.
Edelbrock intake and heads for the 428 are still a good buy compaired to stock |
| | | | | I prefer Holley carbs too -- Royce P, 01/19/2006
At least their carbs don't require engine invasion to change LOL! |
| 9in rear ends -- Sergio C., 01/16/2006
I have a 1967 fastback and I am trying to put a 9in, 1977 licoln Versailles rear end in it. Will it fit with out any altercations to the car or the rear end? |
| | RE: 9in rear ends -- Randy Rutledge, 01/16/2006
I put the same rear end under my 67 fastback. Since I'm using CE's slide-a-link traction bar set up and a rear sway bar, I can't hook up the em. brake. Aside from that it is a dirrect bolt in and something like 2" narrower than the stock 67. That helped me fit my drag radials under there. One thing I noticed is the rear shackle assembly seams to be offset about 1/4" from the spring eye with the versaille rear end. I just got 1/4" longer bolts and used spacers accordingly. That's a better rear end all around. bigger axle tubes and axles, stouter housing, bigger bearings. |
| 427 Edelbrock intake ? -- Randy Rutledge, 01/15/2006
I just picked up and Edelbrock alum. intake that has Edelbrock F 427 on it front and rear with no other markings. Does anyone know about this intake? What years it was made? old, new? Mainly, which is better between that one and the Edelbrock performer rpm. It is going on a hot street built 428. Any info? |
| | RE: 427 Edelbrock intake ? -- John C, 01/15/2006
Randy, I had one on a 67 Fastback S-Code I bought. It was on the factory 390 and I recon it was put on by someone years ago. Anyhow, I'm cloning a GT500 out of the car and am rebuilding the engine. I'm replacing it with an Edelbrock Performer intake and heads. The intake you have is great. I had good performance to about 6,000 rpm's. My opinion but it's a great intake. I think it's an older intake but a goodie. Good Luck |
| | | RE: 427 Edelbrock intake ? -- Randy Rutledge, 01/16/2006
are you using the performer or performer rpm? I'm allready using the performer rpm that's been match ported. It's rated to 6500 but who knows what the truth is. I don't want to put on something lesser |
| | | | RE: 427 Edelbrock intake ? -- John C, 01/16/2006
Randy, I will be using the Edelbrock rpm series instead of the F427. I don't know if you read Hot Rod Magazine's article on the fe 390 build-up in January, 2003? Well, I'm building a 390 roller engine to the specs. of the article. I hoping to produce 450 to 500 hp. The down side of the article...Crane roller cam and lifters with a bronze distributor gear...$1,000.000
I recon I have $7,000.00 in engine parts for the build.
To answer your question, I think your better off with the RPM. Are you going to match port it also?
John |
| Questions before first fire up -- briango, 01/15/2006
I have a few questions with the end of my build and getting ready to fire the engine for the first time.
1. I have Edelbrock heads so do I need to close the valve lash by .008 to allow for expansion, and what should I set them at for an inital reading?
2. I have a Blue Thunder 8V intake and have PB and a C6. I wanted to use the rear port on the intake to install a breather, but I need a vacuum source for the booster. Can I just use the port on the rear carb riser facing the rear of the engine?
3. I need to get some intake mainfold bolts. Are there any issues with them ans using Aluminum heads? WHat are the lengths I need as I have non to go by. I thing there are two different sizes. Has anyone used set screws and then just used nuts on them?
4. The BT intake and valve covers came with rubber o-rings. Do I need to use them and what are they really for?
I hope to drop the egine and tranny in togther this next week or so and I can't wait to get it fired.
Thanks for the help. |
| 390 Adjustable Hydraulic Rockers -- Mike, 01/14/2006
Hello I posted a while back I have started disassembly of my 390. It is an original engine to my 67 mustang. It has the NON adjustable rockers. I was wondering if it is possible to either 1) When rebuilding my stands if it is possible to just put stock adjustables in place of the non adjustable rockers. 2) replace the whole stand with an adjustable setup. I have seen some on ebay are these compatible for my engine. I am rebuilding with very minor mods. My cam will only be around .500 lift or so I plan on using a Comp K kit that was suggested here on the forum. If anyone has any suggestions of going with the adjustable rockers Please Help. Thanks Mike |
| | RE: 390 Adjustable Hydraulic Rockers -- Big Dave, 01/14/2006
I spent a whole lot of time on picking a cam for my 390, and one factor was the adjustable rockers. The main problem was that the adjustable rocker arms had a 1.76 lift ratio and the non-adjustable had a 1.73 ratio. So even if you keep the same cam but use different rockers, the performance will be different, the valves will open more and the intake and exhaust duration will both be slightly longer.
I believe (but I'm not 100%) that Comp Cams calculates the specs on a 1.73 ratio and most other popular brands calculate using the 1.76 ratio. you need to look into that before you purchase a cam, as your performance may vary from what they say.
Also, aftermarket rocker (roller rockers, specifically) arms for the FE are all 1.76 ratio, not the 1.73. |
| | | RE: 390 Adjustable Hydraulic Rockers -- Mike, 01/14/2006
Thanks Dave. I will research this.Would you happen to know if I use longer push rods will it work, I know they sell two different size pushrods for this application. Also I was just planning on using stock adjustable rockers which I can purchase and put them on my Rocker shafts.I figured after the block is decked and heads shaved my ratio is going to be different and without adjustable rockers they're going to tick a little with the stock Rocker assembly, No adjustment what so ever. I have heard of people just putting on the adjustable rockers on there own shafts. this way here they can adjust the lash a little. Mike |
| | | | RThe ratio difference is negligable -- Royce P, 01/15/2006
and won't matter.
You need ball and cup pushrods to use the adjustable rockers. You can get everything you need from any of the vendors listed here:
http://www.network54.com/Realm/fordfecom/links/
Your old shafts and shaft supports can be reused if the shafts are not scored. |
| New Power Steering pump and Brackets? -- Ian Dobson, 01/13/2006
I'm adding a Power R&P setup on my 69 428CJ mustang, I've already got a pulley set that has the dual pulley for a power steering pump, but where can I find a pump and brackets? I don't care if its an aftermarket pump or a ford pump. Thanks the alternator and waterpump are currently the only things driven by a belt.
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| pertronix coil -- loco100, 01/13/2006
question: installing the standard pertronix unit and standard coil they offer. now since the stock ford coil has a resister wire in it from ignition switch to ford coil ,essentually making it a 6 volt coil, correct? since i am installing a new 12 volt coil should i remove the resistor wire or leave alone? |
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