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 |  casting number -- fordlover, 02/14/2004
I am rebuilding a 66 fairlane and have a engine with casting number C3AE 6015H can you tell me what this is? It don't have cross bolts by the oil pan but I have been told it is a 427. all 427's had cross bolts didn't they?This engine don't have cross bolts. I have been told it is a 63 thunderbird 390 but the person I got it from said it was in a 72 thunderbird he bought in 1980 and the had told him it was a 352. The heads are 72 models along with the intake manifold. The only thing out of the ordinary is the the timing gear cover it is about twice as thick as a timing gear cover of a 75 ford f250 that i have Thank you for your help. R.J. |
 | heads -- mark428man, 02/14/2004
#S on heads read C6AE_R!what are these |
|  | Pretty good heads -- Wayne K., 02/14/2004
They are one of the best iron 390 heads around, especially if they have the horizontal as well as vertical exhaust bolt holes. Most agree that they are an equal to the 428CJ heads with the CJ valves installed.
W.
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| | | RE: Pretty good heads -- Geoff McNew, 02/15/2004
14 cap screws are almost as good as 16 (and at Stage8 prices, all the better), and 2.05's are almost as good as 2.09's...pufff....and the 2.17's still don't flow half as much as a Big Chebbie or even close to a 429/460SCJ....and none of this FE stuff is really all too impressive anymore....particularly when LS1's and 5.0's walk us....and they do.....hey, baby, how's your sonic tested 40 year old, something over block with a cast crank and tiny ports really perform....?
I've got the childhood nostalgia out of my system...and my '69 Drag Pack gets sold for something that once again will actually PERFORM....hate to say it, but my old '97 Z-28 w/ 6 speed would bury my Mach 1 on any road I could name, think of, or invent....broken hollow front sway bar notwithstanding. |
| | |  | geoff,Your an idiot,just to be nice. -- steve, 02/15/2004
n/m |
| | | | RE: Geoff lost his mind? -- giacamo, 02/15/2004
Geoff Mcnew i,v sean a lot of fe power that a z cheavy would have a hard time with. one thing to remember don,t blame the car blame the guy wrenching on it........... |
| | | | | RE: Geoff lost his mind? -- Tim P., 02/16/2004
The chevy guys are aways the first to talk S, they take there money and waste it on stupid piss on ford stickers and it goes to show how well it cheapens the looks of a chevy which (they are) True Ford Guys don't need to put cheap sayings on their windows or bumpers about the other guys to prove anything and besides we accept the fact that their are aways going to be someone that will beat us sometime somewhere if not the car, the driverso take that and stuff it down your carb and smoke it being a chevy it will smoke |
| | | | |  | RE: Geoff lost his mind? -- dave, 02/24/2004
UMMM lets see I ve matured and got a Z/28
1 JUMBO SHRIMP
2 military intelligence
3 half full
4 oxy
5 MORON ! |
| exhaust doughnut -- jeff, 02/14/2004
have 67 gal.500 w/390 2v.auto. why does the exhaust allways blow-out on the pass. side exhaust? i hear this all the time w/stock exhaust manifolds. what brand name is the best to replace with. must i replace in pairs and finally what method is best for loosing up bolts? thanks |
| | RE: exhaust doughnut -- Nick, 02/14/2004
I have had the same problem with my 68 on both sides. Its because your using the fibrous material doughnuts, at autozone they have 2 kinds one is the fibtrous for about 99 cents the other, is a solid metal doughnut for $2.59, buy the solid metal one and I gaurantee you wont have the same problem. |
| Cams, cams, cams -- Nick, 02/14/2004
I know this question has had to have been posted here, but I already did a search and did not find what I was looking for.
My question is I have a 68 Gal 390 2bbl, I believe this comes with 285 ponies, I want atleast 400-450. Besides the obvious ( carb) what other mods would be recommended? I know I want to put a new cam/lifters/new valve train, but which one, I am unsure of. Does anyone know of a proven setup thats been dyno'd?
I also plan to go with one of msd's coils, again not sure which one, they all sound good, The one I was looking at was the "6AL".
Are there anyother mods I should do? I am planning on keping it nat aspirated, and I do not plan on putting nitrous in the car.Also I want to use pump gas. So I like to keep the compression at 9.5.
Any comments/suggestions will be helpful.
Thanks Nick |
| | RE: Cams, cams, cams -- galaxiefreak64, 02/14/2004
well i would say a 4x2, and a huge cam, and maybe a 4 speed. try the ingitor 2, its great! |
| | RE: Cams, cams, cams -- giacamo, 02/14/2004
nick i found out a long time ago on a 390 compresion = h.p., 400 hp on 9.5 compresion ! i wish somone had a parts combo that will do that so i can use up a s load of 2v pistones i have laying around.i use msd all thear stuf works great.......... |
| | | giacamo, where are you located? -- Anthony, 02/17/2004
You seem to have a great knowledge of these engines, just wondering where you are located, you never know if someone is in your neighborhood! |
| | | | RE: giacamo, where are you located? -- giacamo, 02/17/2004
Anthony i live in se colorado....... |
| | | RE: Cams, cams, cams -- Nick, 02/17/2004
So what are youre recomendations, I want to put about $800 - $1000 into the motor including an overhaul kit which will be $300.
Thanks Nick |
| | | | RE: Cams, cams, cams -- Gerry Proctor, 02/17/2004
It'll be tough for you to reach your power level with that investment unless you know how to port your own cylinder heads and find a bunch of parts at fire sale prices or free. The power is always in the heads, Nick. I was going to write that it's pretty easy with Edelbrock heads, RPM intake, big Holley, headers and a cam with mid-.500 lift, duration of around 230 or so and wide lobe separation angles. But you'll also need the other bits and pieces to compliment the power like a high-stall converter and low rear gears. All of the sudden, you're talking well over $3,000 and you still have to tune it to get that horsepower out of it.
Perhaps you shouldn't be too concerned with an arbitrary horsepower number and instead concentrate on improving torque in the range you realistically drive the car and expect to see the improvement. It requires an honest appraisal of what you're trying to do but you can have some rather startling results if you ignore the big horsepower number and think torque. |
| | RE: Cams, cams, cams -- giacamo, 02/17/2004
in a 68 gal i,d tos the 68 heads and intake and find a set of pre 1965 heads and 4v intake. the pre 65 intake and heads have larger ports i like the way thay preform at higher rpm,s.new pistons 10 to 10.5 flattops with valve reliefs i use cast for streat and forged for all out racing. mollie rings, melling hi vol oil pump,i drill and tap all oil galery plug holes and install allen plugs. a comp cam,s 265 cam kit with lifters springs single pice valve retainers, timing set . a 650 carb i allways install hardend valve seats on exaust valves. for some reason i see alot of seat erosion on thease heads . this seams to be a decent streat combo as hp spects i used this combo in a 1958 t bird a friend of mind drove to alaska thear he checked hp on a dineo and found it to make 365 hp at 4500rpm this combo i feal is not hi priced bild. if you shop around for your parts.and i,d use 3,25,s or 3.50.s in the rear............. |
| | | RE: fe parts -- giacamo, 02/19/2004
dam i know fe alm heads and intakes are pricie. but you should be abel to get 350 to 375 hp out of a 390 with stock parts,under 1500$ i do and find a machine shop that dont rip you off.maybe i,m just a cheap old basterd but i found out you can bild a engin so hot that it,s no fun anymore for streat use.i enjoy my under 400hp moters that last for over 100000 miles. and give brand X a very hard time...... |
| | RE: Cams, cams, cams -- gagalaxie390, 02/18/2004
Nick,
I agree with some of the others here; 450hp on a limited budget 390 is hard to do.
Here are 2 dyno combos I know of:
First is Mustang Monthly June 1997
390+.030=396
9.8 compression
Edel RPM Heads
Edel RPM Intake
Edel 750 carb
Edel Perf RPM Cam 236-236 dur at .050
2-1/8" headers
Result:
418 hp at 6000
434 tq at 4000
(I think the headers were too big & with a more forgiving 800 double=pumper this engine would have made about 435hp.)
But - did you ever HEAR this cam run?
I have! It's ROUGH. Marginally streetable.
2nd article:
Hot Rod Jan 2003
390+.030=396
9.7 compress
Edel RPM heads
Edel RPM intake
Edel 800 carb
Crane Hyd Roller 222-228 dur at .050
1-3/4 headers
450hp at 5600
460 tq at 3800
....oh by the way Hot Rod priced it out at $6,044.21
It ain't easy to make 450hp from a 390, the 427 Med Riser's "only" made about 470hp (with 11.0 comression!), making 450hp from a 390 is hard no matter what.
But these are the real dyno tests I know of.
Now, I have seen 390-powered Mustangs and stripped (3400lb) Galaxies run at Milan Dragway in the 11's on a single quad - that takes near 500hp no matter how you cut it. But, wild engines. Not streetable.
What would I do?
Build the engine, late heads and all -
then get an Edel RPM Intake & 750cfm carb, Edel or Holley
THen add 1-3/4 or 1-7/8 headers, NOT bigger.
Then add a cam, either one of the ones above or like Comp Cams 270S or 280H or 282S
Then save up for the Edel RPM heads.
Now you will have 425hp or so in a streetable "396".
rwl |
| | | RE: Cams, cams, cams -- Ian Dobson, 02/19/2004
Hehe, I've been buying parts for my 390 and so far I've spent over $3000.00 and I don't have pistons and bearings yet.
the cheapest thing I did to get me an extra 50Hp and cost me $500.00 was I bought a 66 Thunderbird with a 428 in it, and I gave the car away to my uncle without the engine, and I gave him the 390 that I had sitting disassembled waiting to be rebuilt.
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| Will a small block toploader work behind a 390? -- 68 fastback, 02/13/2004
I'm restoring a S code fastback that has a 2v cleaveland with a C-6. I found a 390 GT motor and standard bellhousing and now looking for a toploader. Will a small block mustang toploader work or do I need a 390 mustang toploader. I read that the imput shaft is about a 1/2 inch shorter on the 390 top loader. Thanks for any help! |
| | RE: Will a small block toploader work behind a 390? -- giacamo, 02/13/2004
i,v fited them for 390.s and used them in small blocks to i also use the bearing type pilot shaft bushing only the brounze ones don,t last me..........just make shure the shaft doun,t bottom out and bind you,l be ok...... |
| | | RE: Will a small block toploader work behind a 390? -- Travis Miller, 02/14/2004
Shorten the snout that fits into the pilot bushing and it will work fine. I've done it a few times. |
| | | RE: Will a small block toploader work behind a 390? -- gilles, 02/15/2004
or bolt a truck belhousing, 7/16 deeper, |
| | | | Thank You! N/M -- 68 fastback, 02/16/2004
n/m |
| | | | | RE: Thank You! N/M -- Terry, 02/18/2004
i have just finished doing exactly what you are about to do. I was going to shorten the input shaft but decided not to because there is lots of room behind the crank. Get your measuring stick out and you'll see what i mean. |
| | | | | | Bellhousing change? -- Travis Miller, 02/18/2004
Why go to that much trouble and extra expense when a few minutes with a grinder will shorten the nose on a small block input shaft? I have done it several times when changing 2.32 low geared Galaxie trannys into 2.78 low geared ones. It brings those big heavy Galaxies to life! |
| | | | | | | RE: Bellhousing change? -- Terry, 02/19/2004
yeh, i know what you saying, but you dont need to grind the input shaft on a small block top loader to fit behind a 390 FE, they fit without having to grind the shaft. |
| 390 lids and 63 Galaxie replies,,,,thanks. -- jkaiser, 02/13/2004
Thank you folks for reply on the subjects.The "sisal" chrome on the lids is a cheaper way to go,,yes.But you would be amazed at the chrome places that have no idea what that finish is supposed to look like.I am looking into having these lids reproduced here in the U.S.Most of my work is on the 65 to 73 Mustangs,,,,but now the Full size cars are coming on strong.I think they look and ride better than a lot of the mid-size musclecars anyway.A 68 X-L in black with a gold stripe and 428 with 4-speed and all the toys is hard to beat.I have recently found a 69 X-L,,,G.T. Convertable(yes,Ford DID build a few of these)loaded with every option available,,,and for sale in the Louisville area for 400.00. Car is minus engine(390-2V),,,but otherwize is all there.Guy has NO idea how rare this car is.Lots of these full-size cars are coming out of the woodwork.Wednesday,,i found a 66 LTD.,,,,,factory 4-speed car in a salvage yard in Onieda Tenn.It had to be beautiful new.Factory Raven Black,,,with Burgandy interior,,white headliner and sail panels.Some d/a junked the car in the mid-eighties,,,,so we were told.Said he DROVE it in there.Sold it for 50 bucks to the yard!! |
| | RE: 390 lids and 63 Galaxie replies,,,,thanks. -- BarryMcLarty, 02/14/2004
I have recently come to see your point of view.Have owned a 66 Fairlane 390 GT,a 68 Mustang 390 GT,and a 69 428 Mustang.Love my Mustangs,but when I wanted to get back into a project,found Mustangs in fair shape way out of my price range.Found a 64 Galaxie500 2 dr sedan with a 6 cyl for $1000 in great shape and running.I went retro muscle car,and built a 390 with a tri-power from a 63 Galaxie,and repro fiberglass hood,trunk,and fuel tank from Crites.It is a blast to drive,and gave me an inexpensive starting point for a fun project.And beleive me ,an old restored Galaxie with a big block turns a lot of heads on cruise night. |
| Piston sources -- Jeff, 02/13/2004
I need a source for pistons for my 427 S/O. As of right now, it is .030 over and has .007 taper in the existing bores. So lets say the bores are 4.270. Where can I get the next size pistons for this bore? I have had the block sonic tested and it will take an additional bore. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you forum. |
| | Race Engineering -- Royce, 02/13/2004
561-533-5500
They will help you get the correct oversize piston. I bought a set of custom Ross pistons for my 427 last year, about $500 with pins. Came five days after ordering.
Royce |
| Total Control FE Mustang motor mounts -- Dano, 02/13/2004
Has anyone had any experience with the FE mustang motor mounts from Total control? Do they cause any problems with the FPA or Hooker header fit? |
| 390 air cleaner chrome lids -- jkaiser, 02/12/2004
We just sent one off to the chrome shop in Lexington Ky. They do outstanding work and only charged us 75.00 to do the lid. Ours was for the 69 G.T. Mustang 390 Convt. we are restoring for a client.I have a 69 G.T. fastback with 77K miles and one of only 166 out of 80 thousand fastbacks built that i will be sending a lot of chrome to them to do also. We are checking,,,but strongy believe my 69 fastback is the only G.T. colored with Aucolpoulco blue paint and white luxury interior.Naturally i am intent on keeping a good chrome shop in my "hip pocket". |
| | prices all over the place -- Anthony, 02/13/2004
I just sent mine off to a guy in Florida. Spacecoast Plating. He told me 150-175 bucks to do it. Nice website, and a nice guy to talk to. He is a Mustang lover too. I have had some quotes over 400 bucks! $75 sounds like a bargain, then again, you probably do alot more business with them than most of us. |
| | RE: 390 air cleaner chrome lids -- hawkrod, 02/13/2004
I get mine done for about 60.00 but I want original finish not show chrome. The original finish is called sisal buff and is cheaper as it is not mirror polished so there is a lot less labor. hawkrod |
| 63 full-size convt. question -- jkaiser, 02/12/2004
Hello from Shelbyville,Ky.I am restomoding a 63 X-L. convt.Not harming body at all.This car is from LosAngeles and is totally rust free.What we are looking for is info on a possible reproduction 406 or 427 exhaust manifolds.Or,,,a nice set of used ones.I have heard there are 2 types,,,long and short,,,that we need the short ones due to the fact this car has power steering and is a factory 4-speed.Any help or ideas greatly appreciated.I have added pwr. disk brakes(ala.75 Galaxie wagon,direct bolt on!)and Duraspark ignition.Plus warmed up the 390 greatly.Hence the desire to ditch the factory"log"style manifolds.Phone# is (502)338-1218.Welcome phone contacts too.Thanks Much,,,Jeff. |
| | RE: 63 full-size convt. question -- galaxiefreak64, 02/12/2004
the short ones are called shorties, but ebay has them all the time (expect to pay around $450) |
| | | RE:P-steering with HP manifolds -- McQ, 02/12/2004
You've heard correctly that there are modifications necessary to the power steering if you want to run the long style late '63 406/427 exhaust manifolds. The "shorties" will work well with full size '60-'64 Ford/Merc power steering. The shorty HP manifolds were introduced in '60 for the HP352 and were used through '64 on 390HP, 406 and '61-'64 Police applications. A very nice NOS set just went for $455 on eBay.
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