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| flat spot in accelleration -- rick c, 01/27/2002
i have a 66 truck with a 352 that has been upgraded to a 390 (crank, rods and bore) i still have the origional 352 exhaust manifolds. i have dual exhausts 2and 1/4 pipes with turbo mufflers, a stock cast 4 barrel intake and a 600 cfm holley. i recently changed the intake manifold gaskets from the stock type with the exhaust crossover to the felpro type that blocks the crossover under the carb. i have noticed a difference in the exhaust (louder i guess more back pressure) and now when i slow down from highway speeds to make a turn and accellerate i have noticed a flat spot. does this sound like a coincidence or is this possibly a result of poor flow through the exhaust? any help appreciated. by the way i was origionally thinking of going with a later engine design, but i learned to love my fe as i have learned more and more about the whole engine family and the possibilities! |
| | RE: 1970 Muscle Story Supplement -- Mike McQuesten, 01/27/2002
Is that booklet available in reprint/production? I'd like to have it. I was fortunate to be working at a Ford dealership in the summer of '69 when the original Muscle Parts booklet arrived. I got the first one outta' the box. Still have it and have used it as a reference countless times. I missed out on picking up the supplement you've linked us to but have seen it. A friend even has one......that's the one I've looked at over the years, hmm,now that I think about it, he might be ready to trade something.. |
| | | It's the first place FE was ever mentioned. -- Dave Shoe, 01/27/2002
This supplement (a supplement of the 1969 catalog), is apparently where the term "FE" was introduced to the world.
JMO, Shoe. |
| | | RE: 1970 Muscle Story Supplement -- John M. Sutton, 01/28/2002
Well, Mike, I wish I had one to could consider selling! At least someone has taken the time to post it for us so we can all use it, if not have it. And, I feel pretty good, because this is the first time I've been able to provide something new to this list. Usually I'm asking for help, and although I greatly appreciate all the help Shoe, you and others give, this time, at last, I got to post something! Thanks for that little uplift, Mike! |
| | | | RE:you bet John.. -- Mike McQuesten, 01/28/2002
I really like this forum because it's friendly and seems pretty low on ego trips....although I tend to go off on them once in awhile talkin' 'bout them old Glory Days! But I'm continuing to learn a lot. And I thought I knew so much. Thanks for the thought. As I said a good friend has one. I met him back in '69 at Deer Park Drag Strip up North of Spokane. He was driving his '67 Shelby GT 500/automatic to that strip and laying down easy mid to low 13's. I had to walk up in the pits and introduce myself. His GT500 had a nicely prepped 428(it wasn't stock!) that was his daily and only driver. He sold this to buy a '70 Cyclone Spoiler 429SCJ/3.91 car. Currently he's running a '00 Lightening that runs 13.7 stone stock with a canopy! But you'll love this.....his winter/hunting beast? A '76 F150 4X4 automatic with 428 stump puller. Shorty HP exhaust manifolds. Steve has helped me countless times in so many situations over all these years. He'll loan me that '70 supp. anytime I have a need. He just got done going through the Holleys on local hero Chuck Little's '40 Ford Coupe running a 427 sideoiler with honest to goodness High Riser top end: heads and dual four intake. Chuck is the father of current NASCAR driver Chad Little who had to switch to brand X last year......a $ deal.
Thanks again John for the comments and the link. |
| | RE: 1969 427 emblems?? -- Richard, 01/27/2002
I got mine at a portland swap meet about 15 years ago. And you could get them in any egine size. |
| | Factory boo boo. -- Royce Peterson, 01/27/2002
Tim, They were produced for installation on 1969 Mustang hood scoops. There was never an original 427 Mustang, only the emblems. I would guess it was produced by accident much like the 1969 Cougar GTE emblems which also show up at swap meets from time to time. These emblems must have been produced in the 100's because they are quite common and I would say worth very little. After all, who needs one?
Royce Peterson |
| | | The 427 was a regular prod. engine for 1969. -- Dave Shoe, 01/27/2002
At the start of the 1969 model year, the SCJ had not yet been conceived. The "Q" 428CJ was officially second fiddle to the "W" 427 hydraulic motor, and marketing was looking for a successor which they could give the "R" designation to the new top dog. The magic formula didn't surface in time for the start of the 1969 model run, so the dangling "R" defaulted to the highly visible air cleaner option, instead.
In November of 1969, the first SCJ came rolling off the production line. This cost-effective replacement obsoleted the expensive 427 before the first one was produced for 1969.
JMO, Shoe. |
| | | | RE: The 427 was a regular prod. engine for 1969. -- Tim B, 01/27/2002
There were certainly Drag Pak (SCJ) R and Q codes before November 1969, that would be well into 1970 production.
The last production W code 427 was in the early 1968 Cougar GT-E before they switched to the R code 428CJ in April 1 1968. There weren't Q code 428CJs in 1968.
Holmon-Moody made 427s past 1969, but they weren't regular production.
Tim B |
| | | | | RE: The 427 was a regular prod. engine for 1969. -- Davy Gurley, 01/27/2002
I picked up a set of these in Tulsa at the Shelby meet about 15 years ago. Toyed with the idea of putting them on a hood scoop with a 427 underneath but decided it would just be a thief magnet. So, they are just sitting on a shelf appreciating in value. So far just 5x original cost if this is any indication. |
| | | | | No SCJs before Nov 13, 1968. -- Dave Shoe, 01/27/2002
The reinforced autothermic cast piston is the heart of the 428SCJ story, and the piston wasn't available until about November 13, 1968. As soon as the piston became available, both the SCJ and the CJ started using it, thus obsoleting the original CJ piston.
Ford may have offered some race 428's before this time, but they were forged-pistoned engines which never got a production-line engine designation.
Also, keep in mind that Fordapparently offerd Drag-Pack cars with 390s and other engines in the years prior to the 428SCJ. These earlier Drag-Pack cars were not well known, and I believe they used stock engines with a reinforced drivetrain and steep gears.
Shoe. |
| engine tag -- eddie mcmanus, 01/26/2002
I have '67 Fairlane from my uncle that he bought new. I start the restoration this year and can figure out most of the engine tag but would like a better explaination if somebody would help me out. Thanks. Ed
Tag reads; 390 67 8 6 K 313 A |
| | RE: engine tag -- Royce Peterson, 01/27/2002
390 = Cubic Inches 67 = Model Year 1967 8 = Change Level 6 = Year of production 1966 K = Month of production, August 313 = Identification of engineering assembly code. This engine was a 390 - 4V with Ford / Autolite 4V carb. These were installed in early 1967 Fairlanes with engine code "Z" and were a non - GT engine.
Royce Peterson |
| piston rings -- Matt, 01/26/2002
Can anyone recommend a good set of piston rings for my 428CJ? I was looking at Jegs, they have alot, but I'm not sure what thickness they should be. Thanks, Matt |
| 2V Autolite Carb ID? -- John M. Sutton, 01/26/2002
Can you help me identify what this this 2V Autolite carb is for or orginally from: D9TE AMB C8J23 are on the tag. Thanks! |
| | Wrong letter -- John M. Sutton, 01/27/2002
Oops, that's a D, not a B for the first letter. |
| Ford block numbers -- Mike K, 01/26/2002
I'm trying to track down what kind of engine is in a mustang I purchased about 6 months ago. Here is what I have seen:
- C5AE H stamped on block - 66-427 stamped on rear of block - saw when engine was out of car - C5AE F 6J13 on heads where the center 2 spark plugs are - On block near oil filter : 8C1S or could be 8C18 maybe - very tough to read
- C5AF-9510-BD LIST 3300 205
on the both carbs. Also a tag on carb C5AFBDA 2L2
Can anyone help me out with this. Is there another area on the block that I need to look at? It'll be a the garage next week so I can get a better view then. Thanks in advance. Mike |
| | RE: Ford block numbers -- scott 71 f-100, 01/27/2002
Looks like to me you have a 65-66 427 w medium riser 427 heads with 88.0-91.0 cc combust chambers. 2.185/ 2.195 int valving and 1.723/ 1.733 exh valving. Over all a very performance oriented engine aquarding to steve christ's book. wish I had it.
Scott |
| | | RE: Ford block numbers -- Mike K, 01/27/2002
Scott- thanks for the reply. Where can I get his book? |
| | | | If it is a 427 -- Mike K, 01/27/2002
One other thing. Is it a sideoiler model and if so what's it worth? Thanks, Mike |
| | | | | it does look like a side oiler. -- scott 71 f-100, 01/29/2002
You should be abke to get the book at summit. It is called "How to Rebuild Big-Block For Engines". The author is Steve Christ. If you do a search at summit it should come up. Like $15 dollars but worth it.
Scott |
| | | | | RE: If it is a 427 -- scott 71 f-100, 01/29/2002
if you don't already know about it there is another FE forum on network 54. is can be located at FORDFE.com . here is a link also: http://www.network54.com/Hide/Forum/74182 |
| Rocker arms for 390 (changing cam) -- Ian Dobson, 01/26/2002
Hi, I'm going to change the camshaft in my 390 from my tired old 25 year old erson highflow 2 to an edelebrock performer RPM cam.
one requirement of the new cam is adjustable rockers or pushrods. Any recomendations on what a good set to use are, that will not be too expensive? And does anyone have any experience with that cam, good or bad?
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| | RE: Rocker arms for 390 (changing cam) -- scott 71 f-100, 01/27/2002
haven't had any experience other than here say but it is all farley negitive on the ebock cams. heads and intakes are said to be solid pieces but that cams should be left to another company. Thats what everyone told me so I didn't get it. I am considering a crower or a comp cam. with near the same lift and duration @.050" |
| | RE: Performer RPM Cam? -- Mike McQuesten, 01/27/2002
I can't say from personal experience anything about the E-brock Perf.RPM cam. I do know that their initial offering of the RPM cam was based on similar specs as the C6OZ-B GT/PI/CJ cam. I even wrote to Edelbrock back then asking them how their cam was going to make horsepower all the way to 6,200 as they said in their literature. I never got a response. It was interesting because they were saying then that the RPM cam required adjustable rockers with their lifters. Of course if the lifters were anti pump-up, adjustables are required. Now their second genertation RPM cam has much more aggressive specs. It "look" on paper as if it would be a cam that would make power from 1,500 - 6,200.....estimated. I don't have the specs in front of me here. As for your question about reasonably priced adjustable rockers, you can buy adjustable FE rockers from most parts stores along with the correct push rods. Of course they'll have to order them for you. I would recommend two sources, first, Rob McQuarie at Blue Oval Performance, 3761 S. Kalamath St., Englewood, CO 80110, 303-762-8298. These people give outstanding service and they know what they're doing with all Ford engines including the FE. They would have a full selection of FE adjustables from basic stock to rollers. Another company that gave good service was Rocker Arm Specialist, e-mail: rocker@c-zone.net. They also offer a variety of FE rocker sets from basic to rollers. They've got 'em all at pretty reasonable prices.
Again, I'd be interested in hearing some real world performance facts and results on the Edelbrock Performer RPM cam/kit. |
| | RE: Rocker arms for 390 (changing cam) -- James, 01/28/2002
I went with Harland-Sharp roller tips on edelbrock heads with my 428 and had some problems. I had to take the oil baffles out or my valve covers wouldn't enen go on the engine. I do not like the factory adjustibles because they have no bearing surface just like the non-adjustibles, you get metal to metal and at 40,000 miles you have gauleded the shafts and the racker arms migrating shavings through the engine. This is the Ackilies Heal of ther FE engine. I think that any of the aftermarket rockers are better than the stock one. Just my .02. |
| a 390 bored.30 over=a 428 cobra jet these days.. -- Mike, 01/25/2002
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?Viewitem&item=601105841 there's a bunch of stuff wrong here first no real B.B. Shelby's came with these manifolds, they all had Fomoco manifolds. this C-6 is a early model but has a mighty long tail shaft and i doubt its cast iron, it looks like maybe out of a early PU. Lets see what else we can find? |
| 63 427 or ? -- Phill O., 01/25/2002
Hello all: I have to ask if anyone can tell me what these cyl. heads might be from? casting # C2SE-C they are supposed to be on a 63 427. the engine has a factory try-power but I'm suspicious, thanks for any help, Phill O. |
| | Re:'62 406 -- Mike McQuesten, 01/25/2002
I think the C2SE is a '62 406 Phill. But I think that the '63 406-4V 385 horse used these heads too. The '63 406-6V 405 horse used special C3AE-C. A '63 427 would not be stock with C2SE heads or tri power. If stock is what matters to you. |
| | | Re:'62 406 -- Phill O., 01/27/2002
thanks mike, after being on the road I can't seem to find my ford lit. and my friend wants me to install this in a 67 GT fastback, he tells me it is a 427 but my memory tells me the heads weren't correct . It currantly lives in a 56 ford and regardless if it is a 427 or not it will be a nice piece for the pony. I haven't been able to get under it for a block # yet , but if I have more questions I will post them, thanks again Phill O. |
| | | | RE: Re:'62 406 -- Bob, 01/27/2002
You won't be able to get most Mustang headers to bolt up to thse heads. |
| | | | | RE: Re:'62 406 -- Phill O., 01/28/2002
thanks for the heads up! are there any out there that might? |
| | | | | | Actually, most headers will fit fine. -- Royce Peterson, 01/28/2002
Hooker Super Comps have the up/down pattern to fit the early heads and the port should match fine. Check your heads against a header gasket before installation to be sure of the port match. All the C2SE heads I have seen were high ports similar to Cobra Jet except the bolt pattern.
Royce Peterson |
| | | | | | | RE:one other little thing.. -- Mike McQuesten, 01/28/2002
There's just one other little challenge you'll face dropping that early block, if that's what it really is, it has the early '65 back to '58 two bolt engine mount system. So plan ahead for the correct engine mounts to adapt this early block with C2SE heads into that '67 Mustang.
It can be done. I've seen it lots of times. It was done a lot back in '67 & '68 when guys bought their brand new 390 GT 'stang and immediately got thrashed by a SS 396-350 Chevelle/Camaro, a 389 tri powered GTO, a 400 cubed GM just about anything and a 440 Mopar GTX/RT. Out would come that nice little 390GT and in would go a real high performance FE which generally was a '64 & back two bolt mounter. I never had the opportunity but sure woulda if I coulda. I remember two '67 Mustang GT 4 speeds with owner installed 425 horse center oiler 427s that ran like a HP Mustang should have.
I think Charles Crites at Crites Reproductions makes the full kit to make this installation easy. |
| | | | | | | | That's not a problem either. -- Royce Peterson, 01/28/2002
I don't know how these guys can sell special mounts when the factory mount works fine if you have the skills to drill one hole in each of them. Here's a picture of the driver's side mount from a 427 GTE Cougar. Above and to the left of the "L" engraved in the part you can see a wear mark from the hole you will need to drill. Every late (Post 1965) FE block has all four bosses so the late blocks will fit early cars. The Mustang / Cougar block plate needs this one hole drilled to use an early FE block in a 67 - 68. Let me know if you don't understand this, it is pretty simple once you look at it. Any late FE block can be used to get the dimensions. Make a pattern and drill a 1/2" hole, that's it.
The mount in the picture only fits 1968 Cougars with the 427 side oiler but the FE Mustang / Cougar part is basically the same except for shape at the bottom. Royce Peterson
[Image edited for size & legibility by Admin.]
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| | | | | | | | | RE:that's all you do? -- Mike McQuesten, 01/28/2002
That's all there is to it Royce? Like I've said, I've never intalled an early block into a '65 later chassis. Done the reverse a lot....'65 later into '64 & back and of course there's nothin' to that. But all you have to do is to drill one hole in the '65 later mount to align with the one hole in the early block? Whoa....I think I can do that!
In all respect to Charles Crites though, he's offering whatever it is the market wants. He has been very fair to me in some purchases, i.e., bumpers, hoods, etc. He offers a lot items that wouldn't be out there if it were not for his company. He's a genuine Ohio Ford guy who founded the Performance Ford Club of America many years ago. I miss that organization. |
| | | | | | | | | | RE:that's all you do? -- Royce Peterson, 01/29/2002
I respect Crites because he is making a living at something he enjoys. I had a great time running my 68 1/2 428CJ Cougar at last year's PFCA meet.
Yup, all you have to do is drill one hole on each side and the early block fits into a 67 - 70 Mustang or Cougar. I could not say if this is true for Fairlane / Torino because I have never owned one of those.
Royce Peterson |
| | | | | | | | | | | RE:that's all you do? -- walt, 06/15/2005
i had to do that to the fairlane(66)when i put a 64 high riser in it,made up platesto match the block holes and had tto modifythe mount to fit the plate,andclear the lower bolt hole,cut away the rubber slightly rotate the mount,and drill the lower bolt hole in the mount,also the forward upper and lower bolt hole in the plate to match the mount,the big block mustang is much easier to retrofit,as was noted in this text |
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