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| oil pump replacement -- jeff jones, 10/23/2004
going to replace my oil pump on1967 gal.500,2dr. 390 2v. w/auto. factory shop manual says to jack up motor 1-1/4" and put wood blocks under mounts to hold. question, does trans. have to be loosened too? should radiator be taken out and trans. cooler lines removed also? nothing is said about this in manual. current pump shows 50 lbs. when cold and 20lbs at 60 mph when hot ,10 lbs or less at 525 r.p.m. at idle. eng. has no noise at all. would you recommend a standard pump or heavy volume? engine is completely stock with standard pan. |
| spreadbores -- jeff, 10/23/2004
Did Ford use spreadbore carbs on certain FE engines in the late sixties? Spreadbore autolights that is. |
| | Lots of Autolite 4300s, but no true 'spreadbore' models. [n/m] -- Mr F, 10/25/2004
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| | RE: spreadbores -- Tim P, 10/31/2004
Jeff are you looking for a 4300? |
| aluminum compared to iron? -- BB67FB, 10/22/2004
I have a question for any one who has done weight comparsions on FEs for the heads and intake. if u use aluminum as opposed to iron for both, any ideas how much weight will be saved? |
| | Typical cast iron FE intake = ~85lb.; aluminum = ~20lb. [n/m] -- Mr F, 10/22/2004
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| | | RE: Typical cast iron FE intake = ~85lb.; aluminum = ~20lb. -- BB67FB, 10/22/2004
thanks for the info! any one have a clue about the weight difference between heads? |
| | Typical cast iron FE cylinder head, bare = ~55lb. [n/m] -- Mr F, 10/23/2004
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| carb. # -- jeff, 10/22/2004
I gave an incomplete number on the carb earlier, this is the complete one...its on a metal tag on top of carb . Number is C8AF AS A 8026 it has slightly larger secondaries and is autolight i believe . This carb came with a cobra jet intake would the carb go with the intake? |
| | Sorry, but 'C8AF-AS' is just a 390 Galaxie/Mercury carb. [n/m] -- Mr F, 10/22/2004
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| 390 piston weight -- David, 10/22/2004
Does anyone know the weight of 1973-1976 390 pistons. I am looking for the weight of original Ford parts, not aftermarket. These would be the pistons that came with the 3U crankshafts. Thanks for your help! |
| | I think most 390CID pistons of that period weigh ~23oz. [n/m] -- Mr F, 10/22/2004
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| 9" Nodular case with SPEC on it? -- Larry, 10/21/2004
Where these production units or OTC's? What cars used them? Anything special about them? Thanks |
| | RE: 9" Nodular case with SPEC on it? -- Hawkrod, 10/22/2004
Yes, they were used anywhere from 64-68 and most 67/8 Shelby's had them. They are not uncommon but are very desirable due to the fact that you don't have to match date codes! Hawkrod |
| | Yep - I have Shelby customers just waiting for those. [n/m] -- Mr F, 10/22/2004
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| 428 build advice fro 69 Mach 1 street cruiser? -- jeff, 10/21/2004
The more i have researched building a 428 for my mach one the more i am confused , my 69 currently has a 390 in it but i have a std bore 428 block that is ready to be slightly bored, originally i was going to put a stroker scat crank in (still may do that) but as i reflect on just what i want i wonder just how much money i should throw at this. I'm just after a nice torquey engine that sounds good , some lope to it.
Anyone have a good idea of what to equip this engine with? I wouldnt be taking it over 5800 rpms i doubt. I have stock good rods, crank , cobra jet intake now...what about going edelbrock rpm heads and intake is it worth the dollars? Hooker or FPA headers? Would i be ahead to work with my 390 heads? I can spend some money on this but i dont want to waste money either, its going in my mach one.
To clarify, im just using this mach one to cruise in once in awhile on the street, also what do you recomend for valve train for my rpm limits of 5800 rpm stock ought to be fine shouldnt it? I assume the cam would be in the .550 lift dept (not over that) since the block needs to be bored i would go for the forged pistons...whats brand works well for FE'S? Does the cobra jet intake equal the edelbrock rpm for street use? Same question again does edelbrock exceed performance of a good set of factory heads? thanks again jeff Oh, rearend gears are mid 3s with a wide ratio top loader
thanks for any advice jeff
[Edited for clarity by Admin.] |
| | RE: You're not going to do this all at once. -- Gerry Proctor, 10/21/2004
First, nothing is worth it if you have to spend the milk money to get it done. Beyond that anyone here would have to ask what you expect.
You don't need to spend a lot of money to get a lot of smiles from a 428.
Even the poorest FE heads will easily support 400 hp in basically untouched form if you build the engine right and choose the right cam.
You don't need the alloy heads for what it seems you're looking for. They make it easy to make power but they're not necessary as I see it. Sure the Edelbrocks exceed the non-427 factory stuff but that doesn't always mean that they're a good value.
As to the intake, the CJ and the Performer RPM are just different approaches to the same problem. The only real advantage to the Performer RPM is about 70 lbs. in weight off the nose of the car. They vary by a couple of horsepower so you could save 300 bucks by keeping the iron CJ intake.
As to the exhaust, if you keep your 14-bolt unibody heads then you'll do better with the FPAs since they are made to fit that port. You might be able to get the Hookers to fit, since some folks have, but there is a mismatch that can cause persistent gasket leaks.
You can easily run the stock valve train. Avoid anti-pumpup lifters. They have a particular lash setting where they're designed to work and aren't quite as forgiving as a regular hydraulic if you're a bit under or over. And unless you're spinning the engine over 6,000 rpm, you don't need them anyway. Be reasonable on the cam selection and you'll only have to change the springs in your existing heads. Talk with a couple of the cam grinders and get their opinion and suggestions on what will get the job done. You don't need a lot of duration and very tight lobe angles to get a lope. With a 428, 225-230 degrees at .050 on the intake and 230-235 on the exhaust on a 110 LSA will give you a nice thump and the cam will still be streetable. Keep the lift in the lower .500 range to save yourself from high seat pressures. Vacuum for power brakes can get real iffy though. Comp Cams is a very good street cam grinder and almost always gets it right for the street guy. I don't personally favor their grinds, but unless you have a lot of practical experience through experimentation, go with the sure bet. You're going to ask anyway, so I favor Crane for my stuff.
As to pistons, Diamond is a very good forging and they do support the FE folks. But the others are probably just as good. You do get what you pay for so if you're paying a lot less or a lot more, you need to find out why.
You'll get a lot of opinion. Just understand my opinion is not gospel and has no more value than anyone else's so don't look at the differences as conflict. There's more than one way to do the job. That's just how I would approach the same problem. |
| | | RE: You're not going to do this all at once. -- jeff, 10/22/2004
thanks gerry proctor for the advice |
| | | Excellent response, Gerry. :-) [n/m] -- Mr F, 10/22/2004
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| | | RE:Diamond Pistons? -- McQ, 10/24/2004
Gerry, please tell us more about the Diamond pistons.
I've got a back burner project C6ME 391 block that's in the machine shop right now. Actually it has been there for over a year. Now it's all there waiting for me to bring in the pistons of my choosing. It's at 4.16 overbore and will have a '28 crank/prepped 390 rods. I think I will use the E'brock heads on this one.
Diamond Pistons? Thanks. |
| | | | RE:Diamond Pistons? -- glennz, 10/24/2004
i can help with this one,
diamond racing produces diamond pistons, they use to be a full line engine machine shop, they got so busy making piston's that is all they do know...
i live about 2 miles from their facility here in clinton twp. Michigan, you give them the spec and they make you the pistons, they have a spec sheet that you fill out and what compression you are seeking, they make the pistons...
i am going to have them make mine for a blown 351 C need 7:1 compression... |
| Camshafts -- Mo Diesel, 10/20/2004
Here's a question for the experts...I'm building up the 390 for my 66 Cyclone convertible, 4 speed. So far this is the thought...
66 390 block .30 Forged pistons, ~9.8:1 Eldebrock heads Holman Moody Medium riser single 4bbl intake FPA tri-y headers Cam ??
I would like to go with a solid lifter and have even thought of going with the soild roller. I understand that there is a BIG cost difference between the two, but l like the idea of less strain on the valve train. Looking to get some ideas on numbers, and what the masses run.
The car will spend most of its life on the street running back and forth to the cruise nights and hot dog stands, but want to be able to hold my own when challaged.
Couple of other points, the rear end will be either 3:9 or 4:11, 31 spline with the N case. Wheels will be the stock 14x7, maybe 15 if I can find a set of Hurst wheels.
Thanks in advance |
| | RE: Camshafts -- Gerry Proctor, 10/20/2004
Roller cams don't have to use high seat pressures. And they don't have to be hard on the valve train. Sure, you get to the .700 lift ranges and things are going to be pretty stiff but it doesn't have to be that way. Pick the right roller for what you want...if you want a roller.
But, you really need to discuss this with a couple of the cam grinders. They are the real experts and will give you far better advice than opinions expressed here.
My '67 Fairlane is about exactly the same as yours (including your anticipated drivetrain upgrades -3.89 Detroit Locker in a Strange aluminum carrier with alloy 31-spline axles). I'm using a Crane HMV 278-2NC cam which is far less than what it seems you're interested in. It'll make you pee your pants all the way to 6,000rpm. Just converted the car to a big input, close ratio TL just to make it more interesting. |
| | | RE: Camshafts -- giacamo, 10/20/2004
i like comp cams 270 solid lifter cam for streat use,with the rest of your engin package i,t would be a real preformer and be real eazy on your valve train,i hope i dont sound like i have stock in comp cams, but thay realy wake up the fe if instaled as recommended. |
| | | | RE: Camshafts -- McQ, 10/20/2004
Just to add one more opinion, and that's what you'll get when asking for camshaft recs, I sure like the Comp 282S, that's a solid lifter shaft, in my 427.
I have to say I like the sound of your plan for your '66 Cyclone. Those Hurst wheels(good luck finding 'em) would be fabulous. I've still got the Super Stock '66 article featuring Fast Eddie Schartman ringing out a new '66 Cyclone GT 390/4speed. It was stock with the exception of a dealer installed 4.11 gear set, Hurst wheels and some 7" cheater slicks. I think it ran 14.0 which was like the fastest 390GT test of '66. One of the reasons that Super Stock gave the '66 Cyclone GT, their Super Car of the Year award.
I also like the description of your '67 Fairlane Gerry. Mustangs are great but to me there's something special about the looks of a '66-'67 Fairlane/Cyclone. |
| | | | | RE: Camshafts -- Mo Diesel, 10/21/2004
Thanks for the input fella's.
McQ, you hit right on the head, when I read that same article and saw those Hurst wheels.....ohhhhhh, I got to have those! Your right though, good luck finding them however, there is a company repopping them, only problem is they are close to the same price as the originals.
I have looked at that 280S and the 282S, let me ask you this, what type of over head are you running? Will either one require end stands?
My engine guy is saying that some of the cam companies are having problems with the solid flat tappet cams and that they are wiping out at early hours? Any truth to that rumor? I really want the sound of that solid but don't want the worry if that is a ture statement.
So, any other areas that I should be looking? Is a standard hyd the way to go? I'm really trying to build the retro car as it would have sat in 1966/67, parts from over the counter, or as built for the C/stock class. |
| | | | | | RE: Camshafts -- 390ranger, 10/21/2004
PRECISION OIL PUMP, Has end stands at a reasonable price. worth the piece of mind. Look at comp cams street roller. it is in the catalog i dont have it with me right now. you can find precision oil pumps on ebay do a 390,427 ford search. i run them with my xe-284H comp cam love the cam and the rockershaft stands |
| | | | | | RE: Camshafts -- McQ, 10/22/2004
I'll try to answer your questions with what I know.
First, I'm running a rocker set up supplied by Rocker Arm Specialty in CA. It's pretty basic with reconditioned/bushed stock B8AE Ford adjustible 1.76 rockers with one big difference - rather than the stock self locking adjusting screw, they're is a lock nut with adjusting stud. I have personally had problems with the self-locking screw. The shafts are HD/thicker than stock, and the stands and end supports provided are billet aluminum with solid aluminum spacers replacing the spacer springs. The entire set up fits fine under stock '60 valve covers plus the oil return baffles fit fine with a lit typical tweeking.
The 282S is really limited to around 6,200 rpm. WHich would work great for you.
As for your engine guy saying that there has been problems with solid flat tappets wiping out at early hours....I can't understand or believe that. I know there's always going to be incidents with a lot of variables. I personally have never lost a cam ... yet.
I do run oil restrictors in the heads. Since my current FE is a '63 427, it has to run a solid lifter cam. But I did run a solid lifter cam in a stock 428 CJ with oil restrictors also. But no other oil plugging, etc. I ran the CJ that way(and I ran it very hard to 6,200 rpm numerous times on a real drag strip)for over two years with absolutely no problems at all. |
| | | | | | | RE: Camshafts -- giacamo, 10/22/2004
i,m with McQ the lock nut on the adjusters are a must.i,v try to salvage the early 6 cilinder adjusters that have a longer adjuster and a lock nut on them from the factory.and use them in the fe, i never under stood why ford abanded the lock nut in the fe moters and made the adjusters shorter so you cant put a lock nut on them?one thing i try to use on a moter with a hi lift cam that is going to be run hard is the iron rocker stands i have one set left i keep hopeing to stumbel acrose anouther set thease are a few thing i try to use in a solid lifter set up |
| '69 390 gt? -- pop428, 10/20/2004
I know Ford ran them out in the early months of production, but any Idea as to which month?
I've ordered my Must' by the numbers but it won't be here for months : (
Thanks peter. |
| | "Ran them out..."? Where did you hear/see that info? [n/m] -- Mr F, 10/20/2004
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| | RE: '69 390 gt? -- Kevin Marti, 10/20/2004
Ford offered the 69 390 GT all the way through production from July of 1968 to July of 1969.
Kevin Marti
www.martiauto.com
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| | | Page 112...... -- pop428, 10/20/2004
Dr John Crafts "Boss & Cobrajet mustangs" Subtitled the picture of the '69 coupe on the bottom of the page? |
| | | | Any chance a '70 model could have a 390? -- pop428, 10/20/2004
A freind contacted me saying he looked at a '70 model and the owner claimed it was a 390 GT : | I advised him I didn't believe this possible as the GT package finished in '69?
Peter. |
| | | | | You mean a chance of it being 'factory'? Uh, no. :-) [n/m] -- Mr F, 10/20/2004
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| | | RE: '69 390 gt? -- McQ, 10/20/2004
Please don't think this overly nit picky but was a '69 -S- code powered car really a 390 GT? It's a fact that the 1969 -S- code 390 was "de-tuned" from the '66-'68 -S- code 390. What I mean by the "d-t" is that the camshaft in the '69 -S- code was no longer the vaunted C6OZ-B shaft which saw usage in the '66-'68 390GT, the '67-'68 428PI + the '67, early '68 Shelby GT500 Mustangs, the 428 Cobra Jet, and Shelby GT 500's from KR's on, and I think this cam was also used in the very limited early '68 427 hydraulic 390 horse. In addition to this cam/lifter combo, FoMoCo also topped the '66-'68 390GT off with a Holley 600 cfm. Not so the the '69 -S- code 390(I can't bring myself to add the GT label to the '69 -S- code 390. I think Ford referred to the '69 -S- code as "Improved Performance".
To add a little more credibility to my stance, the '69 -S- code 390 was available in any unibody configuration, i.e., 4 dr. sedans, wagons, etc. I personally have a '69 Torino Country Squire wagon with....yup, an -S-, 5th unit in on the VIN. An -S- code 390 was NOT available in all unibody configurations from '66 - '68, only the '66 Fairlane GT/GTA and Cyclone counterparts, the '67 Mustang and Cougar, the '67 Fairlane GT/GTA & Cyclone GT again(although the -C- code 289 became standard in these cars in '67 with the -S- code 390GT optional), and finally the '68 Torino/Montego GT, Mustang/Cougar GT.
There was, of course, a GT appearance package available to the Mustang/Torino buyers of 1969. But it did not come standard with an -S- code 390. The entire V-8 line up was available to the GT appearance buyer.
I can sum up my long diatribe here with nothing speaks more to there not being a '69 -S- code 390 true GT than that -S- code Country Squire Torino I mentioned above. That engine was exactly like the one planted in the '69 -S- code Mustang coupe blocked up right next to it. Both of these cars ran fine but nothing like the two '66 390GT's I've owned also. The '66 390GT's ran easily to 5,700 RPM. Not the '69 -S- code 390 IP's....4,800 was max. Just like the standard 390 4V's in the old Galaxies. |
| | | | I think Peter's thinking of the GT Equipment Group. [n/m] -- Mr F, 10/20/2004
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| | | | | RE:Peter? -- McQ, 10/21/2004
What? Who? Where's Peter in this thread? I've looked up and down for him. Don't see any Peter.
Good point Mr. F regarding the '69 GT being more than an appearance package as I'd incorrectly indicated.
BTW, here are the VIN's of the two '69 -S- code cars I have:
'69 Mustang plain couple, light Jade Metallic with white vinyl top:
9R01S119767
'69 Torino Country Squire very loaded:
9A38S243274
I will add that the Mustang did have nice PbFord chrome valve covers with a chrome air cleaner lid. The C-Squire Torino did not have the dressy chrome. But both -S- code with same intake and carb. |
| | | | | | Sorry...'pop428' = Peter. He's a customer. :-) [n/m] -- Mr F, 10/21/2004
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| | | | | | | My name was in the messages. : ) n/m -- pop428, 10/21/2004
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| 427 vs 427 -- junior mints, 10/19/2004
I would like to see the opinions of others on this subject. Does the FE427 compare in performance and durability to the Windsor427 stroker? Furthermore, how does the notorious Chevy427 compare? |
| | RE: 427 vs 427 -- giacamo, 10/20/2004
i sean the 427 windsor stroker my 2 cents on it i belive it,s a bomb waiting th explode.i wont knock the windsor in it,s stock form but 427 cubes in that littel package for me is a streach.the 427 cheavy with out a lot of work can never hang with the extended rpm,s the 427 fe enjoys in it,s stock form i steal belive the y block was born for preformance my 2 cents. |
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